poverty level

[L+T 71]

Yes, if a beneficiary is in that type of situation and had the 125% or better that would continue even when moving to the US and getting married, then technically the petitioner could make 0% and they could still get by with the income of the beneficiary. This is not a new revelation. It states this can be allowed in the I-864 instructions. However, this is certainly not the norm and no one is going to advise people not worry about financials cause they can have 0% of the poverty level to bring their loved one here on a K-1.

So, what is your point with all this all the time? It is STILL 125% of the poverty level that is needed, whether at the I-134 or I-864 stage. Now that we have gone around in circles several times, always leading to the same place, I am done with this.

Yes, it is new revolution on this site. Look at what everyone is saying in other threads... they advise people income or cash from fiance does not count for anything, or they must send the money to petitioner to make it work... check them out, there is a lot of bad advice here in these forums regarding the support issues and public charge as it relates to a fiancee potential assets. One thread below states fiancee has $30,000 in the bank and VJ posters telling her it doesn't count for anything. In fact both threads discount fiancee contribution completely!! (REVOLUTION, yes)... Just trying to help some people get the correct information... Sure i would agree a co-sponsor would likely work the best, but if this is not possible, don't tell someone a fiancee contribution is WORTHLESS...

SMALL SAMPLE OF THREADS WITH POOR INFORMATION,

http://www.visajourn...195-form-i-134/

http://www.visajourn...nt/page__st__30

Edited March 11, 2012 by Thomas70

[KayDeeCee 4,893]

No wonder people are confused by all of this when people here categorically state "facts" that are directly in conflict with what the official web site, travel.state.gov, specifically http://travel.state.gov/visa/immigrants/types/types_2994.html#9, says and I quote from this source:-

Do the Same Income Requirements Apply to Form I-134 as Apply to Form I-864?

No. The 125 percent of the federal poverty guideline minimum income requirement, the most recent year's tax return, and other requirements only apply when Form I-864 is needed. Applicants presenting Form I-134 will need to show that their U.S. sponsor's income is 100 percent of the federal poverty guideline.

How then does a novice visa applicant, myself included although I am learning fast, filter fact from fiction?

Peter Wills

By finding sites like this. It is asked and posted here frequently. You can do a search and come up with tons of hits on the subject. We all know what the travel.gov site says, as well as the instructions for the I-134. That form was used for non-immigrants that were not going to be staying permanently in the US and adjusting status. It is not even a binding contract. The consulates know all of this. What is posted here is to help others get through the immigration process. You can follow what the more experienced and knowledgeable people posted about how it all works and the 125% being required, or you can not follow it. It is totally up to you.

Here are just a few threads you can read through about this same topic:

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/348926-poverty-guidelines-requirements/

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/351443-umm-kinda-confuse-can-anyone-help-me-out-k1-affidavit-of-support/

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/351662-need-co-sponsor-or-not-plz-help/

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/351271-affidavit-of-support-i-134-only-needs-100/

[pjpw2320 0]

By finding sites like this. It is asked and posted here frequently. You can do a search and come up with tons of hits on the subject. We all know what the travel.gov site says, as well as the instructions for the I-134. That form was used for non-immigrants that were not going to be staying permanently in the US and adjusting status. It is not even a binding contract. The consulates know all of this. What is posted here is to help others get through the immigration process. You can follow what the more experienced and knowledgeable people posted about how it all works and the 125% being required, or you can not follow it. It is totally up to you.

Here are just a few threads you can read through about this same topic:

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/348926-poverty-guidelines-requirements/

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/351443-umm-kinda-confuse-can-anyone-help-me-out-k1-affidavit-of-support/

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/351662-need-co-sponsor-or-not-plz-help/

http://www.visajourney.com/forums/topic/351271-affidavit-of-support-i-134-only-needs-100/

What is travel.gov? It is a dead link. Do you mean travel.state.gov?

And the same web site reference I quoted is specifically to do with applying for a K1 Visa, and in those instructions it clearly enunciates that an I-134 may be requested and further on also states that the income requirements differ from the I864, which is submitted with the Adjustment of Status application once the foreign finacee has arrived in the States and married.

Am I to understand that you are saying the second step to obtaining a K1 Visa as listed in the travel.state.gov link is incorrect and the I-134 is not part of the process?

My understanding is that a K1 Visa has nothing to do with applicants not staying permanently in the US, but rather is for foreign fiancees who wish to travel to the States to marry and apply for residence. According to the official web site the I-134 may still be requested. Is it wise to ignore this and hope the Consular Officer does not ask for it or be prepared in case it is asked for?

I will always go by the official web sites as I have found far too much conflicting information and statements on other sites, and that is not directed at the VJ web site. I do think the VJ web site is a wonderful resource, however there still seems to be some misinformation and misunderstanding in the forums which unfortunately is unavoidabale on any forum web site.

Peter Wills

[L+T 71]

What is travel.gov? It is a dead link. Do you mean travel.state.gov?

And the same web site reference I quoted is specifically to do with applying for a K1 Visa, and in those instructions it clearly enunciates that an I-134 may be requested and further on also states that the income requirements differ from the I864, which is submitted with the Adjustment of Status application once the foreign finacee has arrived in the States and married.

Am I to understand that you are saying the second step to obtaining a K1 Visa as listed in the travel.state.gov link is incorrect and the I-134 is not part of the process?

My understanding is that a K1 Visa has nothing to do with applicants not staying permanently in the US, but rather is for foreign fiancees who wish to travel to the States to marry and apply for residence. According to the official web site the I-134 may still be requested. Is it wise to ignore this and hope the Consular Officer does not ask for it or be prepared in case it is asked for?

I will always go by the official web sites as I have found far too much conflicting information and statements on other sites, and that is not directed at the VJ web site. I do think the VJ web site is a wonderful resource, however there still seems to be some misinformation and misunderstanding in the forums which unfortunately is unavoidabale on any forum web site.

Peter Wills

Everything you said is correct. However, as you know, the marriage and AOS will require 125%, therefore though the consulate would consider 100% for approval, I believe this consideration would also include forward looking income, such as assets or income from fiancee. Perhaps fiancee cousin own a shop and has job offer in writing... Perhaps the fiancee is well educated and could easily find a decent job, or they have been working at McDonalds for 10 years, stashed away $10,000, and have a skill that can lift the couple into 200% level prior to 864. Going in at 100% without a plan to lift status to 125% may alarm consulate that couple will not meet 864 in future, ie 3-7 months down the road... and thus may consider them risk. Other things such as age, income, education, potential of fiancee etc... can be considered, but they will be looking to clear 864 prior to 134 approval.

[KayDeeCee 4,893]

What is travel.gov? It is a dead link. Do you mean travel.state.gov?

And the same web site reference I quoted is specifically to do with applying for a K1 Visa, and in those instructions it clearly enunciates that an I-134 may be requested and further on also states that the income requirements differ from the I864, which is submitted with the Adjustment of Status application once the foreign finacee has arrived in the States and married.

Am I to understand that you are saying the second step to obtaining a K1 Visa as listed in the travel.state.gov link is incorrect and the I-134 is not part of the process?

My understanding is that a K1 Visa has nothing to do with applicants not staying permanently in the US, but rather is for foreign fiancees who wish to travel to the States to marry and apply for residence. According to the official web site the I-134 may still be requested. Is it wise to ignore this and hope the Consular Officer does not ask for it or be prepared in case it is asked for?

I will always go by the official web sites as I have found far too much conflicting information and statements on other sites, and that is not directed at the VJ web site. I do think the VJ web site is a wonderful resource, however there still seems to be some misinformation and misunderstanding in the forums which unfortunately is unavoidabale on any forum web site.

Peter Wills

Of course I was talking about the travel.state.gov site you were quoting. I thought it was clear enough without typing out the whole thing. It was never meant as a link for you to follow.

All the questions you are asking could be answered by reading the thread links I posted above.

The I-134 form was not drawn up specifically for use by a K-1 visa applicant. It was used by non-immigrants not intending to stay permanently and adjust status in the US. That is what I stated. I never stated you do not use the I-134 for the K-1 visa interview, though some consulates have asked for the I-864 even for the K-1. The interview requirements and procedures are very much consulate specific, but most tend to use the instructions and guidelines for the I-864, even when using the I-134, and that includes wanting to see 125% of the poverty level. They want to see the income is stable and will continue when the beneficiary is in the US, married to the petitioner and filing for AOS. They think ahead and will want to know how you will have 125% in just a few months time, when you only have 100% to offer at the moment.

You can go by what you read there on travel.state.gov. Like I said, it is up to you. No one forces you to read these forums or take the advice that is handed out here.

[pjpw2320 0]

Of course I was talking about the travel.state.gov site you were quoting. I thought it was clear enough without typing out the whole thing. It was never meant as a link for you to follow.

All the questions you are asking could be answered by reading the thread links I posted above.

The I-134 form was not drawn up specifically for use by a K-1 visa applicant. It was used by non-immigrants not intending to stay permanently and adjust status in the US. That is what I stated. I never stated you do not use the I-134 for the K-1 visa interview, though some consulates have asked for the I-864 even for the K-1. The interview requirements and procedures are very much consulate specific, but most tend to use the instructions and guidelines for the I-864, even when using the I-134, and that includes wanting to see 125% of the poverty level. They want to see the income is stable and will continue when the beneficiary is in the US, married to the petitioner and filing for AOS. They think ahead and will want to know how you will have 125% in just a few months time, when you only have 100% to offer at the moment.

You can go by what you read there on travel.state.gov. Like I said, it is up to you. No one forces you to read these forums or take the advice that is handed out here.

Thanks for clarifying this however as many newbies, myself included, are reading and relying on these forums and probabaly also doing research of their own on official sites it would have been helpful if this had been clarified and explained in more detail initially rather than just simply stating something that is seemingly at odds with the official web site.

Cheers.

Peter Wills

[KayDeeCee 4,893]

Thanks for clarifying this however as many newbies, myself included, are reading and relying on these forums and probabaly also doing research of their own on official sites it would have been helpful if this had been clarified and explained in more detail initially rather than just simply stating something that is seemingly at odds with the official web site.

Cheers.

Peter Wills

It is mentioned, clarified and explained here on VJ all the time.

[TnJ 131]

Everything you said is correct. However, as you know, the marriage and AOS will require 125%, therefore though the consulate would consider 100% for approval, I believe this consideration would also include forward looking income, such as assets or income from fiancee. Perhaps fiancee cousin own a shop and has job offer in writing... Perhaps the fiancee is well educated and could easily find a decent job, or they have been working at McDonalds for 10 years, stashed away $10,000, and have a skill that can lift the couple into 200% level prior to 864. Going in at 100% without a plan to lift status to 125% may alarm consulate that couple will not meet 864 in future, ie 3-7 months down the road... and thus may consider them risk. Other things such as age, income, education, potential of fiancee etc... can be considered, but they will be looking to clear 864 prior to 134 approval.

I believe this reasoning is why people should prepare to be at or above the 125% level. I hear too much that consulates are looking for more than 100% so I just wouldn't count on it. Just like some consulates may or may not accept a cosponsor depending on the circumstances of the case. Manila seems to be one of these. If one is planning to marry in the US and AOS to live in the US, plan on making 125% of the poverty level by the time of interview. The assumption is that the beneficiary will reside in the US after marriage. 125% is required for this to happen. Unfortunately, I think people are confused by the classifications of visas and forms. Example being that K-1 is "non-immigrant" visa but not treated the same as other non-immigrant visas.

Edited April 18, 2012 by ToddnJessa

[Fight for Love 98]

Why does everyone says it's $18,000?? i looked it up and it says $15,300

okay base on my research usually at the embassy they base it on 100% poverty using the I-134 affidavit support (K1 visa) then as soon as you guys married and do the AOS they will base it on 125% poverty guidelines using the I-864 affidavit support.

here a website that will explain it..goodluck

http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/86991.pdf

http://www.immigrationkb.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/usa-marriage/7728/Re-I-134-only-has-to-meet-100-of-poverty-guideline

but they where saying some embassy uses 125% due to time frame of AOS..(I-864 affidavit of support)

anyhow better be safe used 125% lol

[Iyawo Ijebu 157]

Depends where you live. We could live perfectly fine on an income like that. In fact we DID while living in Houston and Tony was working AND studying full time and I was unable to work.

Absolutely.

I am on a self imposed auterity measure and I live well below that purposely, even in Los Angeles.

But yes for some even $2m a year is like a death sentence.

[LA NEGRA 19]

Wow all this is confusing cause it does says 125% poverty guidelines for I-864 especific but I wonder where it says diferente for I-134

[JimVaPhuong 4,863]

Wow all this is confusing cause it does says 125% poverty guidelines for I-864 especific but I wonder where it says diferente for I-134

Consular officers follows the policies spelled out in the Foreign Affairs Manual. If you're interested in what the FAM says about the I-134 then read Chapter 9, section 40.41:

http://www.state.gov/documents/organization/86988.pdf

There are a couple of key points about the I-134 that can be summarized from the FAM:

1. Use of the I-134 has been reduced considerably since it's not legally binding like the I-864.

2. K1 visa applicants aren't authorized to use the I-864, and must instead use the I-134.

3. The I-134 doesn't meet the legal requirements of INA 213A (the I-864 does), so the income requirements described in INA 213A (125% of the poverty guidelines) don't directly apply. It's more or less up to the consular officer to decide how much is enough.

The lack of concrete boundaries for the I-134 has led many consulates to develop their own internal policies for the I-134. The experience of hundreds of VJ members has led to a general consensus here that most consulates do NOT follow the general information given on the Department of State website, and they do NOT apply the 100% poverty guidelines threshold as that site suggests. Most consulates apply the same minimum income levels they would apply with an I-864. Some consulates will usually not allow a joint sponsor with an I-134 - there's nothing in either the law or the FAM that requires them to. Some consulates will permit the beneficiary's income to be considered, while others will not.

One thing that is accepted here as gospel - a petitioner who has income comfortably above the I-864 minimums will almost never have their I-134 affidavit of support deemed to be insufficient.

[pjpw2320 0]

Why does everyone says it's $18,000?? i looked it up and it says $15,300

$15,130 actually so the 125% requirement makes it $18,912. See here ..... http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/i-864p.pdf

Note that these levels change depending on the number of people in the sponsor's household. The above figures are the minimum level (2 persons in the household), so that would be for the sponsor and the sponsored person.

[pjpw2320 0]

It is mentioned, clarified and explained here on VJ all the time.

Just because it is mentioned once does not mean that it should never be mentioned again. Things change and even VJ cannot say that the regulations themselves may not change at some point. There is nothing wrong with what this newbie has stated in suggesting that things should be clarified in more detail. If all USA Consulates adopted the same criteria and approach to reviewing Visa applications, which they should as immigrants are coming into the USA and it is the USA's own immigration requirement which must be met, and it is the USA's own Consulates and Embassies, albeit in different countries, which are adopting different sets of criteria, then things would be a lot easier and more easily understood. Visa law is a minefield and unfortunately too much discretion is allowed to individual Consulates in making decisions on Visa applications.

[KayDeeCee 4,893]

Just because it is mentioned once does not mean that it should never be mentioned again. Things change and even VJ cannot say that the regulations themselves may not change at some point. There is nothing wrong with what this newbie has stated in suggesting that things should be clarified in more detail. If all USA Consulates adopted the same criteria and approach to reviewing Visa applications, which they should as immigrants are coming into the USA and it is the USA's own immigration requirement which must be met, and it is the USA's own Consulates and Embassies, albeit in different countries, which are adopting different sets of criteria, then things would be a lot easier and more easily understood. Visa law is a minefield and unfortunately too much discretion is allowed to individual Consulates in making decisions on Visa applications.

Wow, this older thread is revived.

This has not been mentioned only once before. It is mentioned quite often. People ask about it and argue about it frequently. I do not ever recall stating people should not want details. I think there are things that can be searched for and researched. I think everyone going through the immigration process should do extensive reading and researching on the subject and what all it entails before just 'jumping right in'.

The consulates in all the different countries handle many aspects of the K-1 process in their own ways. That is why it is advised to ask consular specific questions in your regional forum. Though as far as the I-134 is concerned, if you follow the guidelines for the I-864 and meet or beat the 125% requirement for your household size, you will most likely not be denied on the basis of your financials. Everyone's situations are different though, so nothing is set in stone or just perfectly black and white. There are gray areas.