Adding Proof of Relationship after NOA1

[pushbrk 12,824]

Members often confuse "evidence of meeting" with "evidence of relationship". They are NOT the same thing by a long shot. Also notice the word is "evidence" not "proof". They are NOT the same thing by a long shot.

I agree with Gary completely, except to say that a photo together is NOT required evidence of meeting. If you have some photos, certainly include a few but they are secondary evidence of meeting.

The foreigner's birth certificate is NOT required with the petition. It's carried to the interview. The US citizen's complete passport is not required and neither is any page of their passport. Boarding passes alone are enough primary evidence of meeting if you flew to the beneficiary's country of residence. Submitting every page of the US Citizen's passport is an optional way of showing evidence of citizenship. If the US Citizen has a certified copy of their birth certificate or a photocopy of their Naturalization certificate, they need not send anything from their passport.

Yes, you could have met at a friend's wedding reception up to two years ago, and then later made contact and started a long distance relationship with no further in person contact or photos and still get the petition approved. Petition approval though, is NOT A VISA. Take your evidence of relationship to the interview fully prepared to present and explain it as well as answer any and all questions about the relationship and the petitioner's life, family, marital history and job.

Evidence of relationship is for the interview. Even front loaded evidence of relationship is FOR THE INTERVIEW. It doesn't help get a fiancee petition approved except in very rare circumstances where USCIS suspects fraud up front.

[Tim/Mav 305]

Your description would work. Many marriage agencies arrange socials where ALL the woemn meet and have their phtographs taken with ALL the men present. If something develops later the agncy will produce the needed photo (for a fee of course) Letters of intent can be signed and mailed later. The G-325 does not have to be signed, the petitioner can fill it out (I can send you the internal USCIS memo about that if you didn't already know it) You do not need a copy of the beneficiary's birth certificate for the petition. Only the petitioner needs that and ONLY if they are using it to prove citizenship, A copy of your passport works just as well.

Read? The OP asked if he needed additional "proof of relationship" and if he could send it. I answered correctly that he did not need ANY proof of relationship for the petition. The OP has a fiancee from Ukraine. Proof of relationship has NO affect (NONE!) on the approval of a petition. It MAY have an affect in some difficult consulates. The OP is not going through one of those. My answer to the OPs question was correct and is not "bad advice". Pictures of the family of your fiancee would have NO affect on the petition process or on the visa process in Ukraine. Kiev couldn't possibly care less if the beneficiary even has a family.

In the case of the OP, it is not possible to even imagine a need for any proof of relationship submitted with the petition. Save it for the interview.

Your advice confuses the steps in the procedure and I hope it does not cause the OP any unnecessary worry.

Wrong again. A letter of Intent must be signed, you cannot add that later. You will get a RFE. (It is a basic requirement of the !-129-F) The G-325-A must also be signed attesting to The truth in your Petition.

But, lets keep the Peace. I would be really confused as a newbee reading your advice and say to myself. Whens my RFE Coming?

[pushbrk 12,824]

Wrong again. A letter of Intent must be signed, you cannot add that later. You will get a RFE. (It is a basic requirement of the !-129-F) The G-325-A must also be signed attesting to The truth in your Petition.

But, lets keep the Peace. I would be really confused as a newbee reading your advice and say to myself. Whens my RFE Coming?

You need not sign a letter of intent DURING the in person meeting. "Later" means after the meeting but yes, BEFORE filing the petition. The G325a NEED NOT BE SIGNED by the foreign fiancee or spouse if not residing in the USA. But it too can be signed "later" (after the meeting but before filing)

You described a situation where two people would meet casually once and then fill out and sign a form and a letter during that meeting. It's a specious example BECAUSE the meeting only fulfills the "meeting" requirement. Letters of intent come after agreement to marry, as would a G325a, signed or not.

I advise you NOT to argue the foreigner's G325a must be signed. Them official memo stating otherwise is ready to be emailed to you on request and links to it have been posted here many times. I also know personally of several cases approved without the foreigner signing the G325a. Read Gary's interview with the Vermont Service Center Director. It will open your eyes.

[Tim/Mav 305]

You need not sign a letter of intent DURING the in person meeting. "Later" means after the meeting but yes, BEFORE filing the petition. The G325a NEED NOT BE SIGNED by the foreign fiancee or spouse if not residing in the USA. But it too can be signed "later" (after the meeting but before filing)

You described a situation where two people would meet casually once and then fill out and sign a form and a letter during that meeting. It's a specious example BECAUSE the meeting only fulfills the "meeting" requirement. Letters of intent come after agreement to marry, as would a G325a, signed or not.

I advise you NOT to argue the foreigner's G325a must be signed. Them official memo stating otherwise is ready to be emailed to you on request and links to it have been posted here many times. I also know personally of several cases approved without the foreigner signing the G325a. Read Gary's interview with the Vermont Service Center Director. It will open your eyes.

Pushbrk. Thats why were here. For help. I will shut up then. Thank you.

[Meg and Nigel 21]

Members often confuse "evidence of meeting" with "evidence of relationship". They are NOT the same thing by a long shot. Also notice the word is "evidence" not "proof". They are NOT the same thing by a long shot.

I agree with Gary completely, except to say that a photo together is NOT required evidence of meeting. If you have some photos, certainly include a few but they are secondary evidence of meeting.

The foreigner's birth certificate is NOT required with the petition. It's carried to the interview. The US citizen's complete passport is not required and neither is any page of their passport. Boarding passes alone are enough primary evidence of meeting if you flew to the beneficiary's country of residence. Submitting every page of the US Citizen's passport is an optional way of showing evidence of citizenship. If the US Citizen has a certified copy of their birth certificate or a photocopy of their Naturalization certificate, they need not send anything from their passport.

Yes, you could have met at a friend's wedding reception up to two years ago, and then later made contact and started a long distance relationship with no further in person contact or photos and still get the petition approved. Petition approval though, is NOT A VISA. Take your evidence of relationship to the interview fully prepared to present and explain it as well as answer any and all questions about the relationship and the petitioner's life, family, marital history and job.

Evidence of relationship is for the interview. Even front loaded evidence of relationship is FOR THE INTERVIEW. It doesn't help get a fiancee petition approved except in very rare circumstances where USCIS suspects fraud up front.

This guy knows what he's talking about. I will add though that if you are sending boarding passes as evidence of meeting, be sure the boarding passes are dated with the year. We sent boarding passes and photos as our evidence and received an RFE. On second look, all of the boarding passes were dated with only the month and day of the flight. USCIS needs the year too. If it isn't on the boarding pass, send also copies of the relevant passport stamp(s) or maybe a matching flight itinerary. Some airlines print the year on the boarding passes, but some do not, so be sure to look.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Wrong again. A letter of Intent must be signed, you cannot add that later. You will get a RFE. (It is a basic requirement of the !-129-F) The G-325-A must also be signed attesting to The truth in your Petition.

But, lets keep the Peace. I would be really confused as a newbee reading your advice and say to myself. Whens my RFE Coming?

I was not wrong the first time. The letter of intent would be "added" to the evidence of a person meeting at a social later (meaning after the social) And before the petition is sent. Please read and try to understand. The OP, I am glad to say, is not confused by your twisting of words and lack of understanding of meanings. And his fiance has the same home city as my wife. Good taste in women to be sure. (I may be biased)

Here is the internal memo from the USCIS

________________________________________________________________

Interoffice Memorandum

To: SERVICE CENTER DIRECTORS

From: Michael Aytes /S/

Acting Associate Director for Operations

United States Citizenship and Immigration Services

Department of Homeland Security

Date: November 1, 2005

Re: Guidance for Processing Pending Form I-129F Petition for Alien Fiancé(e) when

G-325A for Petitioner and/or Beneficiary is not Signed and/or Photos not Submitted.

Purpose

To provide field offices with guidance on processing Form I-129F petitions when the accompanying G-325A is missing signatures and/or photographs.

A properly executed Form G-325A is required for all I-129F petitions. Previously it was standard practice to issue an RFE when the beneficiary failed to sign the G-325A and/or failed to submit photographs. From the date of this memorandum, an RFE should not be issued in instances where the beneficiary failed to sign the G-325A and/or failed to include photographs provided that the beneficiary is residing abroad. The beneficiary will be required to sign the Form G-325A and/or submit photographs at the time of visa issuance abroad. It is also not necessary to RFE for the petitioners signature on the G-325A, if the petitioner failed to sign it. The signature of the petitioner on the Form I-129F should be deemed sufficient for purposes of adjudicating the petition. Finally, it is important to note that the petitioners photograph is still required for the adjudication of the I-129F, so if it is missing, it must be requested prior to adjudication.

Questions regarding this memorandum may be directed through appropriate channels to Mica Pilz of Service Center Operations.

__________________________________________

Feel free to read the information given in the pinned topic above anytime you like.

Edited February 28, 2011 by Gary and Alla

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Pushbrk. Thats why were here. For help. I will shut up then. Thank you.

Thank YOU.

[pushbrk 12,824]

This guy knows what he's talking about. I will add though that if you are sending boarding passes as evidence of meeting, be sure the boarding passes are dated with the year. We sent boarding passes and photos as our evidence and received an RFE. On second look, all of the boarding passes were dated with only the month and day of the flight. USCIS needs the year too. If it isn't on the boarding pass, send also copies of the relevant passport stamp(s) or maybe a matching flight itinerary. Some airlines print the year on the boarding passes, but some do not, so be sure to look.

Yes, that's a good add. I was addressing the assertion that the complete passport copy was needed. It isn't. Yes, many boarding passes don't have the year and I would always include the passport stamps if available. In the case of a lost passport, I've seen boarding passes plus a matching itinerary used successfully when boarding passes didn't state the year.

[Aeolus7000 1]

Thanks to Everyone!!!!

The following is what I sent. The boarding passes did have dates and highlighted and receipts too.

4 photos of us together, her and her brother, me and her brother and father, and her parents and I

itinerary with boarding passes, to and from

passport stamps, and receipts from ukraine

my phone bill, showing me calling her before I went, and showing I made calls from there

5 different PARTS of chat--- this is what got me worried, because I felt later I should have sent more.

[tommy_melissa 0]

Thank YOU.

[PhilAmTx 14]

let there be peace on earth :whistle:

[Barbara J 115]

let there be peace on earth :whistle:

Assembling the I-129F Package: Checklist

Forms and Documents (follow these assembly instructions. All supporting documents must be in English or be translated as noted here.):

1. Payment as required by USCIS. Use a personal check so you can track the payment. Money Orders are also accepted. 2. Cover Letter (see example). Should include a description of what your are petitioning for (I-129F), a table of contents (list everything in the packet). If you need additional room to explain your case, attach a separate sheet (list the attachment on the cover sheet). Make sure to sign and date the cover sheet. 3. Form I-129F: Petition for Alien Fiance(e) (see example) 4. Declaration of how you met in person in the last two years. This should be a single typed page attachment regarding question 18 of the I-129F. Make sure to sign and date it. 5. Original statements (from both the US Citizen and foreign fiance) certifying an intent to marry within 90 days of entering the US on a valid K-1. (see example) 6. Proof of having met in past two years. (click here for examples) 7. G-325A filled out by the US Citizen signed and dated (see example). 8. One passport-type photo (see specification) of the US Citizen. Write the full name of the US citizen on the back. Place in a plastic bag and label the bag "Photo of <Insert US Citizen's Name>". Attach the bag to a sheet of paper and place behind the corresponding G-325a. 9. G-325A filled out by the foreign fiance(e) signed and dated (see example). 10. One passport-type photo (see specification) of the foreign fiance(e). Write the full name of the foreign fiance(e) on the back. Place in a plastic bag and label the bag "Photo of (insert foreign fiance(e) name) ". Attach the bag to a sheet of paper and place behind the corresponding G-325a. 11. Copy of the Birth certificate (front and back) for the US Citizen or a copy of ALL pages of the US Citizen's passport issued with a validity of at least 5 years or a copy of the US Citizen's naturalization certificate (front and back). This is used to establish citizenship. 12. Copy of final Divorce Decree(s) or Certificate(s) for the US Citizen and/or foreign fiance(e) if either has been previously married. If the previous marriage of the US Citizen and/or foreign fiance(e) ended due to the death of their spouse then include a Copy of Death Certificate(s) documenting that fact. 13. Proof of Legal Name Change if either the US Citizen and/or foreign fiance(e) is using a name other than that shown on the relevant documents. You must give USCIS copies of the legal documents that made the change, such as a marriage certificate, adoption decree or court order. 14. In regards to Section C Question 2, if applicable provide certified copies of all court and police records showing the charges and dispositions for any specified conviction(s) (in accordance with the IMBRA). See section 9 of the I-129f instructions for more information.

Documentary Proof of Having Met in Person in the Past Two Years and an Ongoing Relationship:

Use as many of these items are possible. There is no minimum, but the more you can provide the less likely you are that you will receive an RFE. Additionally, please note that providing proof of your ongoing and genuine relationship in this package may benefit you by allowing the consulate to have access to this information prior to them formally contacting the non US Citizen fiance. Many high risk consulates approach cases with a skeptical eye and providing this information early on in the original I-129F package will help them in their preliminary review of your case.

1. Copies of all airline boarding passes, train passes, itineraries, hotel receipts, passport stamps (make sure you can read the dates on the stamps), and other documentary evidence that you have met within the last two years. You may want to highlight or place post-it notes indicating the dates and locations on the copies (to make the adjudication easier) for the person reviewing your file. 2. Color Photo's of you and your fiance(e) together. Make sure you write your names, date, and location on the back of every photo. Provide two to five photo's. If you only have a single copy of the photo, then make a color copy and send that. If it is a digital photo, have it printed at a company such as kodakgallery.com. You can also make duplicates of photo's at your local photo store (Walgreeens, CVS, etc). Place photo's in a plastic bag or photo sheet and label the sheet. Note that you may not receive originals of photo's back. 3. The following items will not typically show proof of having met in the last two years however will show proof of an ongoing relationship: Copies of phone bills, cell phone bills, emails (you can edit personal info with a marker), letters (edit personal info also), stamps on the letters (to document the date they were sent), and other written documentary proof. Provide a reasonable amount; two to four of each type. Pick a range of dates up to and including the present. You can also include a copy of engagement ring receipt (this is something that is a big optional - do not worry if you do not have a ring yet!)

A lot has changed with 129f we received RFE for photos, affidavits

[pushbrk 12,824]

Thanks to Everyone!!!!

The following is what I sent. The boarding passes did have dates and highlighted and receipts too.

4 photos of us together, her and her brother, me and her brother and father, and her parents and I

itinerary with boarding passes, to and from

passport stamps, and receipts from ukraine

my phone bill, showing me calling her before I went, and showing I made calls from there

5 different PARTS of chat--- this is what got me worried, because I felt later I should have sent more.

More than enough. No worries. Take anything else you want to the interview.

[Tim/Mav 305]

Thank YOU.

I APOLOGIZE. I did not read the Topic Correctly. It says After NOA1. The whole time I thought it was The Orginal I-129-F Petition. Sorry Gary and Alla.

[baron555 934]

I APOLOGIZE. I did not read the Topic Correctly. It says After NOA1. The whole time I thought it was The Orginal I-129-F Petition. Sorry Gary and Alla.

Whew....glad that's over. Yes OP, you are good to go. I'd suggest you leave this basic K-1 forum and show up in the RUB regional forum where you will receive Embassy/country-specific information. Each region/Embassy is a little different and some want information that others do not want.

I marred a Russian woman but I like Ukranskis too!