Ukraine Name Change.. Oh my .......

[SMR 368]

I am responding to both Brad and LvivLovers.

We had the advice of an attorney in Donetsk on this matter. She advised having the property in the name of at least one person that is a citizen AND resident of Ukraine. It was OK, we are told, that Alla and I are on the deed also as long as at least one of the owners lives there. Our flat is my MIL's "official address" though she has her own one-room across the street, which was alwsys just kind of her "bedroom" anyway. That one-room is hers but it also listed in Alla's name. The issue of her mother coming here to live has never been seriously considered though. We have spoken about her getting a tourist visa (if she could) and come for visits for maybe 90 days or so.

If she came here to live that would be another matter and we would address that. I cannnot answer that for you.

Alla transfered what money she had here by using an ATM to withdraw it. It was not a lot of money and she took it out in $200 increments. Her mother also panicked a couple years ago, opened a bank account, sent Alla a debit card and asked her to withdraw ALL her money and bring it back to her in US dollars. Oh well. Anyway, she did and had no problem. Again, not a lot of money and in $200 increments.

It's not an issue I have right now, but out of curiosity, what are the specifics of your incremental withdrawal? How long did you wait between withdrawals? Did you use the same ATM or different ones? $200 actually seems like a low limit if you are talking about waiting a day between withdrawals.

[Ryan & Inna 0]

Does anyone know what the property taxes become "if" choose to become a USC ?

also

Does property taxes change when becoming a permenant resident in USA? (when owning property in UA)

just curious, not sure where to look

thanks!

Edited November 23, 2010 by Ryan & Inna

[LvivLovers 39]

Thanks a ton for the info, guys! That was kind of thought as well...finding an international bank with Ukraine presence. I just don't trust Ukrainian banks at all after the story of what happened to my wife's friend. We're going to look for a lawyer to try to get some more info if we can find a good one...my wife is skeptical whether there will be one who knows about such issues, but we'll see. We've still got a good bit of time left to solve the questions, but I'll report back the answers once we figure something out. Thanks again for all the help!

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

Does anyone know what the property taxes become "if" choose to become a USC ?

also

Does property taxes change when becoming a permenant resident in USA? (when owning property in UA)

just curious, not sure where to look

thanks!

Such things may be the jusidiction of the Oblasti so I can only tell you what the attorney told us for Donetsk Oblast. If the property is owned by a person that does not RESIDE in Ukraine, our property tax would be nearly 10 TIMES more than it is now. It does not matter if the person is a Ukraine citizen or not. If they do not RESIDE in Ukraine they get hammered!

It is somewhat higher if they reside in Uraine but do not live at the property...ie. a rental property. This is similar to the "homestead" exemption common in the US. My MIL is a listed OWNER of both our flat and her flat and lists OUR flat as her "official" address. her flat is much smaller so better to take the "homestead" exemption on our place. We worked this out with her in an equitable manner.

Again check with a knowledgable person in the Oblast and/or city where the property is owned before making decisions.

[Ryan & Inna 0]

From what I've gathered as long as there is a Ukrainian Resident (Living IN Ukraine) listed as an owner of the flat -- the tax issues do not become 10x and there is little to worry about...

Our situation is currently this:

Inna has flat ownership with her mother and is worried about getting the immigration stamp in her international (external) passport. This excerpt from the law is from 1995 mentions you have to hand in your local passport...but since its from 1995 we dont know if its still in effect?... we assume it is. And it mentions something about releasing your ownership and only after this they put the stamp into the international passport. Inna does not want to lose her ownership in the flat.

The only reason we "think" we need this stamp is for passport control when leaving Ukraine AND to change Inna's name in her International Passport and Internal Passport.. Is this when we should have Inna's USA permenant address somehow (not sure how) affixed to her internal and external passports

We're not fully informed yet and are seeking advice

(also note this post is from 2005)

http://www.zhensovet.com/ut/topic/4431-iaadhaaae-eiieadhaoeeaae/page__st__20

П О С Т А Н О В А

від 31 березня 1995 р. N 231

Про затвердження Правил оформлення і видачі

паспортів громадянина України для виїзду за

кордон і проїзних документів дитини, їх

тимчасового затримання та вилучення

....

13. Для виїзду на постійне проживання за кордон у паспорті

робиться відповідний запис, виїжджаючий здає свій паспорт

громадянина України з позначкою про виписку з місця проживання.

Під час видачі паспорта для зазначеної мети громадянину

роз'яснюється вимога статті 21 Закону України "Про громадянство України" ( 1636-12 ), згідно з якою він зобов'язаний після прибуття на місце проживання за кордоном стати на облік у дипломатичному представництві або консульській установі України.

При этом закон "Про громадянство України" на который ссылается ст.13 уже не действует, и следовательно штамп получать нужно, а регистрироваться в консульстве - нет.

А насчет потребуют ли штамп на выезде - это как повезет. Теоретически штамп должен быть, но воспрепятствовать Вашему выезду на основании отсутствия штампа по закону вроде нельзя. Думай сама....

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

From what I've gathered as long as there is a Ukrainian Resident (Living IN Ukraine) listed as an owner of the flat -- the tax issues do not become 10x and there is little to worry about...

Our situation is currently this:

Inna has flat ownership with her mother and is worried about getting the immigration stamp in her international (external) passport. This excerpt from the law is from 1995 mentions you have to hand in your local passport...but since its from 1995 we dont know if its still in effect?... we assume it is. And it mentions something about releasing your ownership and only after this they put the stamp into the international passport. Inna does not want to lose her ownership in the flat.

The only reason we "think" we need this stamp is for passport control when leaving Ukraine AND to change Inna's name in her International Passport and Internal Passport.. Is this when we should have Inna's USA permenant address somehow (not sure how) affixed to her internal and external passports

We're not fully informed yet and are seeking advice

(also note this post is from 2005)

http://www.zhensovet.com/ut/topic/4431-iaadhaaae-eiieadhaoeeaae/page__st__20

П О С Т А Н О В А

від 31 березня 1995 р. N 231

Про затвердження Правил оформлення і видачі

паспортів громадянина України для виїзду за

кордон і проїзних документів дитини, їх

тимчасового затримання та вилучення

....

13. Для виїзду на постійне проживання за кордон у паспорті

робиться відповідний запис, виїжджаючий здає свій паспорт

громадянина України з позначкою про виписку з місця проживання.

Під час видачі паспорта для зазначеної мети громадянину

роз'яснюється вимога статті 21 Закону України "Про громадянство України" ( 1636-12 ), згідно з якою він зобов'язаний після прибуття на місце проживання за кордоном стати на облік у дипломатичному представництві або консульській установі України.

При этом закон "Про громадянство України" на который ссылается ст.13 уже не действует, и следовательно штамп получать нужно, а регистрироваться в консульстве - нет.

А насчет потребуют ли штамп на выезде - это как повезет. Теоретически штамп должен быть, но воспрепятствовать Вашему выезду на основании отсутствия штампа по закону вроде нельзя. Думай сама....

You do not need ANY stamp in the passport before leaving Ukraine. The laws have changed greatly since 1995. If any such thing was necessary you would either need to get it before the issuance of the visa or you would be advised of it at the visa interview. They do neither. An example is the Philippines which has several items the women MUST do before they can get the visa issued. One is to attend some sort of training class.

It is not unusual for the women to hear lots of inaccurate information. Alla did. The consulate put it best to me when they said "She has a visa issued by the United States they BETTER NOT try to stop her!" Alla had heard she needed some sort of stamp saying she didn't owe any taxes in order to leave the country.

[Ryan & Inna 0]

You do not need ANY stamp in the passport before leaving Ukraine. The laws have changed greatly since 1995. If any such thing was necessary you would either need to get it before the issuance of the visa or you would be advised of it at the visa interview. They do neither. An example is the Philippines which has several items the women MUST do before they can get the visa issued. One is to attend some sort of training class.

It is not unusual for the women to hear lots of inaccurate information. Alla did. The consulate put it best to me when they said "She has a visa issued by the United States they BETTER NOT try to stop her!" Alla had heard she needed some sort of stamp saying she didn't owe any taxes in order to leave the country.

That is comforting to hear...

What about the stamp for subsequent trips to Ukraine / USA... if traveling on greencard will passport control give trouble (are they looking for such stamp?) for not having the "stamp" in her international passport... at this time We're planning to come back to Ukraine for a visit every few months once we get greencard (we may consider going on AP but the time differences to greencard seems not too bad).

[Brad and Vika 129]

That is comforting to hear...

What about the stamp for subsequent trips to Ukraine / USA... if traveling on greencard will passport control give trouble (are they looking for such stamp?) for not having the "stamp" in her international passport... at this time We're planning to come back to Ukraine for a visit every few months once we get greencard (we may consider going on AP but the time differences to greencard seems not too bad).

Vika has been back to Ukraine twice on her GC, and once with AP. She has no stamp anywhere in any passport that says she lives elsewhere. They don't care.

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

That is comforting to hear...

What about the stamp for subsequent trips to Ukraine / USA... if traveling on greencard will passport control give trouble (are they looking for such stamp?) for not having the "stamp" in her international passport... at this time We're planning to come back to Ukraine for a visit every few months once we get greencard (we may consider going on AP but the time differences to greencard seems not too bad).

No.

We have three members of our family who travel with Ukrainian passports and green cards and have done so several times. Never a problem or question of any sort. Between myself, Alla and our son we spend 2-3 months in Ukraine each year which is why we keep the apartment there.

There are many other members who do the same and no one has ever reported a problem

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

That is comforting to hear...

What about the stamp for subsequent trips to Ukraine / USA... if traveling on greencard will passport control give trouble (are they looking for such stamp?) for not having the "stamp" in her international passport... at this time We're planning to come back to Ukraine for a visit every few months once we get greencard (we may consider going on AP but the time differences to greencard seems not too bad).

I guess I don't know how to tell you that this is a complete non-issue. Do not worry. We have exactly the same situation regarding property ownership.

Also...

We live in a border area and Alla and our sons frequently go to Canada by land travel. Green cards only, no passport needed, no questions asked (except the usual border crossing stuff they ask everyone) Our son is absent from the US for 10 months at a time when he is in school...no questions asked when he returns with his Ukrainian passport and green card. He DOES maintain a residence here, has a Vermont drivers license and files his income tax returns.

You do not need to worry about thia.

The AP, FWIW is a document which allows her to return to the US, it does not allow entry into other countries. Her Ukrainian passport will allow her to enter Ukraine, of course. But she will not be able to go to Canada, for example, until she has her green card and for toher countries she will still need a visa, but it will be musch easier to get.

[LvivLovers 39]

My wife has been back to Ukraine as well just using her GC and there were no problems. Never got any sort of exit visa or stamp...I still don't know if that was just something from the past that is no longer needed or if that is what you are technically supposed to do if you are planning to become a permanent resident. As of now, we are not planning to do any sort of notification to Ukraine even after she becomes a citizen. Still haven't decided if we will try to upgrade her Ukrainian documents or not...to be honest I still haven't been able to figure out definitavely if that's legal or not (or if she loses Ukrainian citizenship once she becomes a USC). It looked to me like she would lose Ukranian citizenship when becoming a USC but I'm no expert at reading that stuff.

[Ryan & Inna 0]

When we are traveling to US from Ukraine

Can we go through foreigner check point together or do we go separately through our respective checkpoints (Me (USC) through foreigner checkpoint and Inna through Ukraine citizen checkpoint). I assume at this time is when Ukraine Passport, Greencard (or AP), and Name change certified documents (translated apostilled marriage certificate and if obtained translated and apostilled name change court order) are presented?

Thanks!

God bless everyone for sharing your experiences!

[Gary and Alla 3,694]

When we are traveling to US from Ukraine

Can we go through foreigner check point together or do we go separately through our respective checkpoints (Me (USC) through foreigner checkpoint and Inna through Ukraine citizen checkpoint). I assume at this time is when Ukraine Passport, Greencard (or AP), and Name change certified documents (translated apostilled marriage certificate and if obtained translated and apostilled name change court order) are presented?

Thanks!

God bless everyone for sharing your experiences!

When entering Ukraine YOU must go to the "other passports" line. She can go to either. When coming back to the US you can both go to the "US Citizen and Resident" line.

When entering Ukraine, or when leaving for that matter, she need ONLY show her Ukrainian passport. She does not need to show her green card leaving and entering Ukraine. She WILL have to show the airlines her green card when she checks in, but that is not the government. The airlines are required to determine she has SOME form of document to enter the US before she can board a flight to the US. That is OUR rule, not Ukraine's.

When entering the US she will show her passport AND green card. THAT is when she would need to show her marriage certificate, it at all.

This really is not at all complicated or an issue. I am out of breath just reading your summary. It isn't like that at all.

when we go to Ukraine, Alla shows her passport, that is all. NOTHING else when she enters. They ask no questions, never have. They stamp it and away she goes. I give them my passport and that white card you have to fill out. No questions asked, they stamp it and I go on my way. When we leave Alla shows her passport and green card at the ticket counter, then shows her passport ONLY at the "passport control". I show my passport. Never a question. When we enter the US she shows her green card and passport. So far, no questions asked. The occasional "welcome home" and that is all.

It is FAR more difficult to cross into Canada where they seem to delight in playing 20 questions, but that is about it. The usual "Do you have any weaons?" Yada. yada.

It took you longer to read this post than you will spend entering Ukraine, except maybe for long lines.

[Brad and Vika 129]

I give them my passport and that white card you have to fill out. No questions asked, they stamp it and I go on my way.

Just an FYI - in Odessa about a month ago, there were no white cards at all. I thought they had run out of them or something, and I would have a problem leaving. There were no questions, and no one asked for a card, so I can't say for sure, but Odessa might have stopped the practice.

[eekee 182]

Just an FYI - in Odessa about a month ago, there were no white cards at all. I thought they had run out of them or something, and I would have a problem leaving. There were no questions, and no one asked for a card, so I can't say for sure, but Odessa might have stopped the practice.

It is a national decision. It's not something that one city or airport can decide not to do independently.

You now only need a migration card if you are travelling internationally with an internal passport--I guess only Russians etc. in Ukraine would need to fill one out now:

http://www.expatua.com/forum/index.php?topic=6849.0