Does the Consulate extend the expiration date?

[Teacher Mark 53]

VN style?!!! Hellz yeah man!... who gets the coffee$? its almost over!

That seems to be where they draw the line, but I wouldn't be surprised if it happens.

[Frank and Duyen 0]

I have been following this board for quite a while and I must say that this guy Scott is really missing the big picture. Rather than focusing on how to get his fiance over here, he is wasting his energy in knitpicking the wording of the emails from the Consulate in which we all beleive are cookie-cutter emails. What happened to all the big talk you had back then when you fiance first got placed on AP? I recall in some posts you clearly stated that you know some people in high places who can make things happen and clearly the Consulate is messing with the wrong guy. If you really do, then why are you here loosing sleep over an email? I went through this journey once before I know how everyone here feels but keeping your mental state stable is more important than anything else ...

I go over every email they send me with a microscope, cookie cutter or not. Im looking for some clue as to what the heck is taking so long.

Scotts a good guy, if you read all his posts you will see that. Were all here to read and share information. I for one appreciate his insights and opinions.

Frank

[BinhJerome 14]

I have had my problems with Scott in the past, regardless if in your eyes he is not looking at the big picture or not maybe this is his way of helping him deal with being helpless. I do agree that at times his post seem to nit pick things that do not mean anything, and for the longest time I thought it was very odd that he was always giving advice to people before he had ever filed a application for him and his fiancee, but I also felt the same way with others (Jim) but all the people here for the most part do try and help people, they may or may not have good advice, but the reason it may or may not be good is simply because each case is different. I moved to Vietnam because we were denied, and I was in Scott's spot for a long time as well, and I am sure that I also nit picked things that did not need to be messed with but each person has his or her own outs. Not to disagree that Scott went off the deep end saying "they don't know who they are messing with and that he had friends in HIGH places" But to each his own. Scott does not know me, and I do not know him, I know OF him and he knows OF me as well. I am sure that I have just as many friends in HIGH places as he does, and maybe more, but really who cares this is not a pissing contest, and you do have the right to make comments to peoples post and to view your opinion just as we do as well. Scott, they will not "touch" your case, but when they do get to it and they see it has "expired" they will go on as business as usual, this is what the CO I met with in HCMC said, he also said at times they have been known to use the experiation during AP as a reason for denial, and the change in the wording on their website was made in part due to this. I have never seen anyones denial on VJ state experation as a reason, so I assume it is very rare that they would use that, and I feel they would never use that as an only reason. Also I asked him about previous marriages and he told me that if the marriage was ended within 6 months of filing for a visa that this is VERY hard to overcome, not only because there should be a greiving (or relief) period, but for cultural norms in Vietnam, then I said that there was a 6 month period usually before the interview took place he laughed and said good point, and when I asked him about my case dirrectly he said that my ex wife should not have ever been an issue since the divorce was done in 2006 and we did not file until 2009 and we had been divorced for an entire 2 years before we ever met. So I think the big hurdle that is hurting your case right now is your divorce happening so closely to you meeting your fiancee, but I do not know your exact specifics on when you filed or anything like that. The other big reason for AP was only 1 trip prior to an interview, and I also confronted him about this because the only requirement is 1 visit within a two year period before you file, I guess they train them to overlook this part of the requirements, so that part for you is in the clear. Good luck and hang in there Jerome. btw if you want I am going to have lunch with him again tomorrow if you would like I can ask him about your case to see if he can give any clue as to when they would be reviewing it.

[Bernie C 24]

Right or wrong, here is my simple take on the petition validity scenario.

If everything happens within the "normal" time frame there is no issue.

If things get held up for one reason or another AND the initial visa application from the beneficiary is getting close to experation of the petition the petitioner may request an extension (ie. the consulate phase has not begun due to delay.

Same as above but no extension is requested. The petition reaches its expiration date - no action has been taken and no request for extension has been filed. I have heard on some occasions a notice is sent informing that the petition is about to expire. If no action is taken the petition expires and becomes invalid.

If everything happens "normally" yet case runs over due to RFE - auto extension granted

If everything happpens "normally" then case goes to AP - this is the scenario so many are dealing with and that the question is about!

It seems as though if the visa processing portion is never reached and no extension is requsted that the case may be viewed as abandoned - yet once the visa applications have been submitted and there continues to be "activity", it may be automatically extended for some time period for which there is no certain knowledge by the petitioner.

Maybe I'm just talking to hear myself this morning but those were a list of scenarios I came up with while pondering over this.

I wish it provided some benefit but no that I read it over I realize that its pretty much worthless knowledge.

Sorry about that

On another note - I think it would be really cool to meet more of Bro's here in person. I've had the pleasure of meeting Jim and Phuong (and the "kids") and Ralph and Hanh and they are great. Maybe some time in the future whether while traveling in the US or VN it may be possible to meet more and bring the "family" philosophy a bit closer!

If anyone is ever traveling to NW Pennsylvania (Hometown Erie, PA) let me know. We are 1.5 to 2 hours from Cleveland, Pittsburgh, and Buffalo.

[ScottThuy 140]

I can relate Bernie..JohnCali will be here in a month or so to visit with his wife and do some fishing... we were hoping Thuy will be here by then but who knows. Had dinner with Mark in HCMC a few times and am glad we met.. a really nice guy... We had planned togo visit Ralph but Mark said he was closed for the holiday so I missed that... When I fellout in the consulate, there was a VJ member there to help (not a CO).. thanks again for that feelinglucky!

This aint about me..its about the process and it helps to have others here to get through it... just trying to see some light at the end of the tunnel for those in AP not just me.... today is the 6th month for Frank and I cant begin to imagine his frustration.... we look at things as if we are waiting in a line to get to a window to get the decisionormuch like waiting in an ER waiting room... the thing is, if we were standing in a physical line, and it was taking a very very long time, we would begin to look around to see #######... why is the line not moving, When will we get to the window, did they go to lunch?, where is the supervisor?, the thing is- that we begin to look for anything that may exist to get the line moving or to get some clue as to how long it will take....

The AP topic was created so everyone knew who was waiting and what to expect. Based on those time frames from last year,most of the people in AP have taken longer than normal to get a decision. Given the current processing times, had Frank refiled when he got stuck in AP, he would be getting an interview on the new case about now.... It hurts to see VJ couples that filed in 2010 and are already approved andsomany are waiting in AP...

[Just Looking 0]

@Scott: Your last post is exactly my point! I might have came off a little harsh on you but I just want you to know that the point I was only trying to make is to take it easy. That is all. I saw you day in day out trying to decipher the content of the emails from the Consulate or other members who post the entire emails they have received and I can show you the very same emails I have gotten from them 6, 7 years ago and the wording are exactly the same, word for word, nothing had changed since then. So, what does it tell you? It means they have a template for every kinds of inquiry. All they have to do is cut and paste and voila, you are off their arses for another 2 weeks. Read the email again, did it specifically adressed to you or it was a generic Dear Sir? I came to this VJ Forum many years ago but I never registered to be a full member. Back then, there was not as many Vietnamese cases as like now and I only came to read what people posted here. There used to be a HCMC's CO that frequently posted here and his insight was valuable. Unfortunately, he is no longer around. I must admit one thing that the bond between members of the VN forum in particular today is stronger than back in my days but it is also more noticeable that it takes much longer for people to get out of AP and the rate of denial is increasing. Thus, members are more prone to frustration and agony. It is unfortunate for all of us that we have to go through HCMC Consulate, where it has the highest rate of fraud so in the CO's eyes, everyone is guilty as charge. At the time, we were put on AR (Administrative Review) for almost 3 years with much of that 3 years the case was sitting on someone's desk at the Fraud Unit untouched. It took me many trips to the Consulate, many #######-licking emails if you will, many knocks on the doors of many goverment officials offices and a great deal of pain and agony before my case was reviewed and make it out of AR alive. There used to be a member here who had to wait more than 5 years. Imagine how hard it was for him. But we all made it. Now, looking back it gives me goosebumps but looking at my wife, I love her even more and I thank her for the faith she had in me. This is the journey I took once and never again in this lifetime. Now, I know how hurtful it is for Scott or anyone in AP to see someone who comes after but got pink while you guys are still on pause. That's not a good feeling. You guys congratulate that someone but deep down in you, I know you wish that person could have been you. So, regardless of what I say, what others ecourage you to do ... You are the one who face the dilema and only you can do something about it. Take my words and don't ask me why - Congressional inquiry does have a profound effect on your case and each case, now, has certain dealine/time frame to be closed whether its denied or approved.

[toddandhien 2]

I strongly suspect that the 4 month original validity is used to close a case when there is no response to either Packet 3 or Packet 4. That way, they are not waiting forever on cases where the petitioner or applicant is non-responsive. As long as things are in process, they will extend the validity automatically as long as necessary. However, I don't believe that they actually "extend" the validity by putting a new expiration date on it. Rather, when they get to processing it, as long as it is active in the system, they will continue with it regardless of the original expiration date.

In response to Bernie's comment, one does not have to request an extension. We were in AP at NVC for about 5 weeks, so when our case got to HCMC and started to be processed there, I worried that it might expire. I e-mailed and asked the question and they said that there was nothing that needed to be done; it was common for time to run out and that as long as it was being processed it would be "automatically extended."

Scott, the expiration is really a non-issue. The thing that is of real importance (IMO) is getting a CO to look at your case sooner rather than later. I would focus all of my energy in that direction if I were in your boat. Don't waste your time with e-mails that are answered by VN girls (no offense to VN girls, I am married to one) who staff the customer service positions. They give canned answers in literal book english. you want action not words.

[ScottThuy 140]

Todd I never thought that they were VN staffers answering emails, but I guess that is very likely... At this point given DoS's 60-90day AP provision, I don't know of much any of us can do to get the case looked at before the 90 days, but I understand that after the 90 days an atty can make an inquiry and possibly get things moving... The big picture is that many of us are in AP and the way things are going, many of us will still be in AP when Linda starts harvesting..

I agree 100% now that the petitions once they arrive at HCMC and become active in that system are good as long as the CO wants it to be good... if they want to say they case has expired then it is.. as was said.. Iwashoping there were some milestones in place but it seems there are not... when the CO feels like opening the file to look at it, then and only then the decision will be made...

[ScottThuy 140]

Scott, the expiration is really a non-issue. The thing that is of real importance (IMO) is getting a CO to look at your case sooner rather than later. I would focus all of my energy in that direction if I were in your boat. Don't waste your time with e-mails that are answered by VN girls (no offense to VN girls, I am married to one) who staff the customer service positions. They give canned answers in literal book english. you want action not words.

Todd is spot on! I got confirmation last night... No USC would make the grammatical errors that were made in the email response I got last night. It was obvious that it was one of the VN girls that are hired to do the clerical work that is answering the emails we send. The quote below shows what I mean...

When I met with the congressional liason yesterday, We came to the conclusion that asking a question about a specific document that was submitted, would require them to manually open the file folder and look at the document to response to his question.. The idea was that this may cause them to go ahead and get the file out of the way while it was open and on a desk... I had sent a similar request for info two weeks ago asking if the police certificate was what they expected as the two previous submissions were rejected, and the email response I got last night was,

"Our records show that we have received all requested documents from the beneficiary including the police certificate. We regret that we cannot accommodate your request to check on the beneficairy’s police certificate at this time. A consular officer will review additional information and the case file to determine if all supporting documents are meet the requirements. The beneficiary's file is currently pending review for such of review. "

This was actually the first response I have ever gotten that had a read receipt associated with it. They care when I read the email they send me? I suspect that was done in error.

I am interested to see if they will provide the same response to the congressmans office... I wonder if the fact that they got his request is why they responded to mine in two weeks rather than 3. Its realy starting to look like they do a once a year batch processing of AP cases.. in October after the start of the new fiscal year... not looking forward to 5 more months in AP.

[Frank and Duyen 0]

Todd is spot on! I got confirmation last night... No USC would make the grammatical errors that were made in the email response I got last night. It was obvious that it was one of the VN girls that are hired to do the clerical work that is answering the emails we send. The quote below shows what I mean...

When I met with the congressional liason yesterday, We came to the conclusion that asking a question about a specific document that was submitted, would require them to manually open the file folder and look at the document to response to his question.. The idea was that this may cause them to go ahead and get the file out of the way while it was open and on a desk... I had sent a similar request for info two weeks ago asking if the police certificate was what they expected as the two previous submissions were rejected, and the email response I got last night was,

"Our records show that we have received all requested documents from the beneficiary including the police certificate. We regret that we cannot accommodate your request to check on the beneficairy’s police certificate at this time. A consular officer will review additional information and the case file to determine if all supporting documents are meet the requirements. The beneficiary's file is currently pending review for such of review. "

This was actually the first response I have ever gotten that had a read receipt associated with it. They care when I read the email they send me? I suspect that was done in error.

I am interested to see if they will provide the same response to the congressmans office... I wonder if the fact that they got his request is why they responded to mine in two weeks rather than 3. Its realy starting to look like they do a once a year batch processing of AP cases.. in October after the start of the new fiscal year... not looking forward to 5 more months in AP.

Scott, I received an email with return receipt from them yesterday !

[ScottThuy 140]

likely the same person responding to both of us... I am glad Thuys dad told her to go back to work while she waits... it really takes an emotional toll.

I am in 100% agreement with Todd at this point that emails from me will have little or no affect on our case. A congressionalor senate inquiry is just a note in the file that says someone other than us asked about the case. IMO when it comes to HCMC that has little impact as well. I suspect it allboils down to the paperwork they have, the interview notes and the mood the CO is in when they decide to go through the box of case files sitting in a closet somewhere.

lets hope that the changing of the guard will bring us all some resolution.

[lindal24 1]

Scott & others in AP: Inquiries about your case should continue to be sent, but don't expect too much in return from the email. Getting worked up or overly anxious isn't going to help your case or your mental health. I know how anxious you are about getting results whether its a denial or approval, but you guys should let the process take it's course.

Patience is key, but just remember that everything will work out in the end!

[Frank and Duyen 0]

Scott & others in AP: Inquiries about your case should continue to be sent, but don't expect too much in return from the email. Getting worked up or overly anxious isn't going to help your case or your mental health. I know how anxious you are about getting results whether its a denial or approval, but you guys should let the process take it's course.

Patience is key, but just remember that everything will work out in the end!

[toddandhien 2]

Scott & others in AP: Inquiries about your case should continue to be sent, but don't expect too much in return from the email. Getting worked up or overly anxious isn't going to help your case or your mental health. I know how anxious you are about getting results whether its a denial or approval, but you guys should let the process take it's course.

Patience is key, but just remember that everything will work out in the end!

Linda, I completely disagree with this advice. It is true that everything works out in the end. However, it does not always work out favorably.

Having an overly optimistic attitude and approach in this circumstance is not prudent, IMO. If it were simply a waiting game and it was certain that the visa would be forthcoming after some period of time, then I would agree with you. Just go about your business and wait for the call. However, that is not the case here...actually far from it.

I am not advocating high anxiety, I am advocating for a prudent and well thought out course of action, with emphasis on the words prudent and action. I believe that Scott should employ all reasonable methods available to him to get the case reviewed by a CO quickly and with a favorable outcome. I only advised that repeated e-mails answered by staffers was an ineffective method of getting the needed attention on his case. But other, more direct methods are certainly called for here.

Dreaming, hoping and trusting do not get results. Action gets results.

Scott, stick with it.

[lindal24 1]

I also agree with actions. What I don't believe in is OVER ANALYZING the response of your actions.

Sending emails, visiting the consulate, asking for help/voice from sentators and congressmen are great "action steps", but over analyzing every tiny little response is can't be good for your health. Just because you might not be satisfied that the reviewing CO is not personally responding to your email isn't going to help your case out anymore than if you didn't.

I was in Scott's position at one point as many of us here have been or are in. I'm just trying to stress the point that if you keep focusing on the minor details and not the big picture, you'll drive yourself crazy.

People get approved, others get denied. We make it work regardless of the approval/denial. If the relationship falls apart because of a denial, what does that really tell you about the relationship? I'm not saying to stop sending inquiry correspondence (quite the opposite actually), I'm just making a recommendation to take it easy and let the process run it's course.

I know what Scott and others are going through in AP, I've been there. Trust me, when I was in AP, I was also quite active in my case, but not to the point where I found myself monitoring who was responding to my emails at the HCMC Consulate. Regardless of what we do here stateside, the ultimate decision rests in the hands of the reviewing CO, so the process does need to run its course, my only advice is not to let the minor details like who responds to your emails drive you crazy.

Scott & others in AP: stick with it, but don't let the minor details drive you insane!