N-400 Application Question About Detention

[Itzhak101 0]

All,

I have just sent my N-400 based on marriage to a U.S. Citizen and got an Notice of Acceptance document. I started to doubt myself about the question regarding prior arrests and detentions after talking to a friend of mine who has recently naturalized. I have indicated in the application that i have never been arrested, detained...etc; however, my friend thinks that i may have been "detained".Here is what gives me second thoughts:

Couple of years ago, my wife and I had a heated argument and she has threated to kill me with a kitchen knife (she's from Brooklyn)...Then, I threw her cell phone to the wall and broke it. Being super pissed off at me, she called the police to the house. Hearing both sides of the story, police arrested my wife and charged her with aggravated assault / felony. While the police were in the house they have questioned me inside the house and questioned her outside the house. I was not arrested, handcuffed, physically restrained whatsoever. I have simply talked to the officers and explained them what went on. After the arrest i posted a bond and got her out and hired an attorney to defend her. Eventually, the State dropped the charges and the case was closed.

In my opinion i was not detained, restrained or arrested; so, i answered the questions as "no" in the N-400. But, my friend thinks that I was "detained" by the police officers while i was being questioned. According to him it was a detention because me leaving the house in the middle of questioning would result in my arrest. So he advised me to contact USCIS and send them the arrest and court records...

My wife and I both have very obnoxious personalities and we argue. However, after this argument, we never had such a heated argument. We always tried not to escalate the things to that point...I am just trying to make sure that Uncle Sam has all the informationthey want. I don't care if I may be questioned by USCIS for this incident. We have nothing to hide.

So, do you think i was detained? Should i contact them explain what's going on and send them the arrest record, court records...etc or wait until the interview and mention this at the interview?

Only logical and honest responses please.

Itzhak

[Kathryn41 3,205]

No, that is not a detention. They were questioning you in response to call for assistance. After questioning you, they filed the charges against your wife. You were not charged, you were not detained, you were not arrested. You assisted them in their investigation by answering questions during their response to a complaint. Big difference. You can certainly obtain copies of the complaint, the arrest record and the court documents but what they will show is that your wife was charged, not you.

[Itzhak101 0]

We have the complaint, case dockets, attorney contract and all other things related to this incident. The arrest record and the State complaint claims that I am the victim.

Should I write a letter and send copies of these to USCIS? Also, which address can such a letter be sent to? Texas Lockbox or National Benefits Center where my application is pending at.

Thank you

[Kathryn41 3,205]

I would not worry about it. Bring the documents with you to the interview but don't worry about trying to send them 'after' the application in the hopes that they will meet up. Chances are that the two sets of information will never be matched up, so hold on to it for the interview. You were right to answer 'no' though - you were not detained. You were questioned in your home about an incident where you shown to be the victim.

[lucyrich 20]

Sometimes the person being detained doesn't even realize he's being detained. Often, a person would have to ask the officer, "am I free to go?" in order to know whether or not the officer is detaining him. Your friend has a point. It's possible you were being detained.

But I suspect it's more likely your experience falls under consensual contact. For some background on the difference, see:

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_defi..._police_officer

As a practical matter, if you mail them something now, I'll bet it will be lost, and your record won't find its way to your N-400 file. You can certainly try, but in order to have a good chance of your information reaching the right place, it may be better to wait until they send something to you. This may mean that your first real opportunity to disclose things to them is at the interview.

The really big thing you want to avoid is a willful misrepresentation or omission of a material fact. Willful misrepresentation of a material fact is the "death penalty" of immigration, leading to deportation and permanent bar. Since I don't know whether you were detained, I'm not sure if you've made a misrepresentation at all. If you have, I don't think it was willful, since you thought that you hadn't been detained. And I also don't believe it was material, since I think that, if they knew the full information, it wouldn't be likely to change their decision on your naturalization.

But my opinion about whether it was material or willful doesn't matter at all. I suspect you can improve your chances of staying well clear of that "willful misrepresentation of material fact" by volunteering to disclose it at the first opportunity.

I don't think the encounter with the police, in itself, is a problem at all. But people have had serious problems due to failure to disclose even minor encounters where the person wasn't at fault. It was the failure to disclose that was an issue. So when in any doubt, I'd disclose, because that eliminates any possibility that they'll later come after you for willful misrepresentation of a material fact.

[Itzhak101 0]

Thank you very much for the responses.

Lucyrich you are spot on. I may have been detained without me realizing it or without someone else telling me that I was being detained. Did I have the option to leave the house and walk away from the house? Absolutely not. It would have been an arrest. I did consent and responded the officers' questions in a civil manner; however, it doesn't change the fact that I had no other option other than refusing to cooperate and getting arrested. On the contrary, detention may be defined as physically restraining someone (handcuffing, holding..etc). I called the USCIS and asked them to define what they mean by "detention". The rep red a generic text about having any misdemeanors, felonies, arrests...etc. She was clueless.

I may have misinterpreted the my situation. This is why I am asking about your opinions whether or not you would consider it a detention.

I do not want to wait until the interview to break the news to the immigration officer who is working on my case. I will send them a sworn testimony via certified mail and attach copies of the case documents. I will also bring the originals to the interview. I am trying to provide them all of the asked information to the best of my knowledge and ability. N-400 guidelines are very vague and I can't get a straight answer from USCIS. So I will write them and bring this up at the interview as well.

I really appreciate your responses.

[Captain Oates 910]

Thank you very much for the responses.

Lucyrich you are spot on. I may have been detained without me realizing it or without someone else telling me that I was being detained. Did I have the option to leave the house and walk away from the house? Absolutely not. It would have been an arrest. I did consent and responded the officers' questions in a civil manner; however, it doesn't change the fact that I had no other option other than refusing to cooperate and getting arrested. On the contrary, detention may be defined as physically restraining someone (handcuffing, holding..etc). I called the USCIS and asked them to define what they mean by "detention". The rep red a generic text about having any misdemeanors, felonies, arrests...etc. She was clueless.

I may have misinterpreted the my situation. This is why I am asking about your opinions whether or not you would consider it a detention.

I do not want to wait until the interview to break the news to the immigration officer who is working on my case. I will send them a sworn testimony via certified mail and attach copies of the case documents. I will also bring the originals to the interview. I am trying to provide them all of the asked information to the best of my knowledge and ability. N-400 guidelines are very vague and I can't get a straight answer from USCIS. So I will write them and bring this up at the interview as well.

I really appreciate your responses.

My experience is UK rather than US, but English law is at the very center of US law so I am pretty sure it's applicable

I was a Police Officer for 6 years and I passed my Sergeant's exams and Inspector's exams - they are the highest and I came 4th in the UK in the Inspector's exams and I was asked to go on the special accelerated promotion course at Bramshill or to be sponsored for a law degree at Leeds University - that's just background so you know I have a feel for this stuff

If you were detained you would be aware of it. When a police office stops you for speeding, you are not detained while he is talking to you and writing the ticket. If you try and drive off you will be detained or arrested

What happened to you is no 'worse' than talking to a Police Officer while he questions you about speeding - it is not detention

I have a fixed penalty speeding ticket and the officer spoke to me for 5 minutes and I knew I couldn't go - but it wasn't detention

Edited August 21, 2009 by saywhat

[TBoneTX 44,920]

To be certain, talk to at least two criminal attorneys.

[NickD 202]

Definition of detained is.

de·tain (d¹-t³n“) tr.v. de·tained, de·tain·ing, de·tains. 1. To keep from proceeding; delay or retard. See Synonyms at delay. 2. To keep in custody or temporary confinement: The police detained several suspects for questioning. The disruptive students were detained after school until their parents had been notified.

Believe all of us here detained for one reason or another, traffic officer stops you because there is an accident ahead, or you are detained because you are a witness to a crime or an accident. Can carry this to the nth degree, but feel what the USCIS is if you were directly detained for some suspected crime that you yourself committed. In literal terms, you can be detained as the victim of a crime and not the perpetrator. Sounds like your case, but the key, is there a written record of it like some police report buried away in the archives. Could just explain the technically you were detained by a crime committed against you where the perpetrator was arrested. Since the police were involved with this dispute, somebody must have called them, was it you?

When stuff like this happens, people don't think to get a copy of the police report when the event took place, never know when something like this will come back to haunt you. Maybe you can still get that.

[Captain Oates 910]

To be certain, talk to at least two criminal attorneys.

I feel this is getting ridiculous now - there is no way that the USCIS would see this as detention...

'At least 2 attorneys' - does this mean 3 ? See 3 criminal attorneys and if 2 says he wasn't detained he should see a third ?

Why stop at 3 ?

It's like a murder mystery now and people are indulging themselves in imagination

If a police officer stops me in the street and says 'did you hear a scream about and hour ago'

and I say 'no' does that mean I was detained by the Police ? of course not

I think someone has to be told they are being detained for them to be detained.

Detention is like sex - you will know that it happened if it did

It didn't

[NickD 202]

To be certain, talk to at least two criminal attorneys.

I feel this is getting ridiculous now - there is no way that the USCIS would see this as detention...

'At least 2 attorneys' - does this mean 3 ? See 3 criminal attorneys and if 2 says he wasn't detained he should see a third ?

Why stop at 3 ?

It's like a murder mystery now and people are indulging themselves in imagination

If a police officer stops me in the street and says 'did you hear a scream about and hour ago'

and I say 'no' does that mean I was detained by the Police ? of course not

I think someone has to be told they are being detained for them to be detained.

Detention is like sex - you will know that it happened if it did

It didn't

It's the nebulous way the N-400 form asks questions like did you belong to any fund raising organizations? United Way certainly fits that bill. What about, did you ever commit a crime you were never caught or arrested for? Is voting for other than an incumbent a means of overthrowing the government? Then the threat of not getting USC if you answered any of the questions inaccurately and taking the questions at their literal value. How many days did you spent out of the country in the last five years when you have only been here three? If your husband is supporting you and you have sex, are you a prostitute? Either are doing it for money, either directly or indirectly. What if your traffic fine is $500.00 and not $499.99 with no inflation factor involved? Ha, beg the judge for a penny discount.

[Captain Oates 910]

To be certain, talk to at least two criminal attorneys.

I feel this is getting ridiculous now - there is no way that the USCIS would see this as detention...

'At least 2 attorneys' - does this mean 3 ? See 3 criminal attorneys and if 2 says he wasn't detained he should see a third ?

Why stop at 3 ?

It's like a murder mystery now and people are indulging themselves in imagination

If a police officer stops me in the street and says 'did you hear a scream about and hour ago'

and I say 'no' does that mean I was detained by the Police ? of course not

I think someone has to be told they are being detained for them to be detained.

Detention is like sex - you will know that it happened if it did

It didn't

It's the nebulous way the N-400 form asks questions like did you belong to any fund raising organizations? United Way certainly fits that bill. What about, did you ever commit a crime you were never caught or arrested for? Is voting for other than an incumbent a means of overthrowing the government? Then the threat of not getting USC if you answered any of the questions inaccurately and taking the questions at their literal value. How many days did you spent out of the country in the last five years when you have only been here three? If your husband is supporting you and you have sex, are you a prostitute? Either are doing it for money, either directly or indirectly. What if your traffic fine is $500.00 and not $499.99 with no inflation factor involved? Ha, beg the judge for a penny discount.

Love it ! You talk like me sometimes so be careful or you will end up a difficult old codger ! I am on a self prepared 'nice' course this week and fighting my critical urges - but all this talk of 'detention' just coz a copper has spoken to you makes my blood boil with 'aaarrrgghhh' thoughts. If I am in a traffic line at the ferry terminal, have I been detained ? I can't go forward, back or sideways and I want to and I am being prevented by a guy in uniform. Think I will put that on the N400

My wife is very 'earnest' and it's a good job she is the USC or when asked 'Have you committed a crime nobody else knows about', she would wrestle with what to say for days. I am the opposite and when I am asked about overthrowing the legal government by armed force, I think back to 1776 and feel like putting 'don't judge people by your own deplorable standards'

Anyway I am being detained from my coffee by writing this - detention is everywhere

In Washington, the OP could have shot his wife between the eyes with 357 magnum and gotten away with it as self defense - so answering a couple of questions like 'did it hurt when she bashed you over the head with the frying pan' is hardly detention, more a kind of prurient curiosity

cor

[Italian_in_NYC 259]

You only need to check yes if you were arrested. That's it.

Even traffic tickets, no need to check yes unless it's DUI or fine >$500, which usually lead to arrests anyways.

Let's cut the paranoia.

[Captain Oates 910]

You only need to check yes if you were arrested. That's it.

Even traffic tickets, no need to check yes unless it's DUI or fine >$500, which usually lead to arrests anyways.

Let's cut the paranoia.

Totally agree - its paranoia

I think there is something in the UK now known as 'detention' as distinct from 'arrest'

That's why I was careful to say I am not an expert in US law and I am also out of date with UK law

I havent researched the UK detention thing yet but I am absolutely positive this OP was not detained

I served 6 years in the UK police and we had to symbolically put our hand on a person's shoulder and tell them they were being arrested - I am sure detention will involve telling them they are detained.

In the US you are screamed at, thrown to the floor and a 40 caliber Glock is shoved in the back of your head while you are being cuffed, tazered and 'rag dolled' by a big black police dog with buckets of saliva dripping from it's fangs. This is a good indication of detention

This even happens to the 18 year old boys who go round to a house on the the invitation of a fake 13 year old who goes on the internet and says she is looking for a good time, so what what happen to a violent person would be quite spectacular