US Healthcare going Public

[CBR 0]

In the US if you are poor you can get Medicaid (t19), if you are old you have Medicare. I believe these programs should be fixed before trying to institute anything new. We all know that both programs have their problems, are complex and confusing and that coverage of medications, tests and procedures is regulated by the government which is #######. If a patient doesn't meet the government's criteria, they don't have coverage for it.

This is the example we have of government run healthcare and I believe it is why most Americans don't want yet another government run program.

How is Canada's healthcare coverage different from Medicare and Medicaid? Do they let the doctors order tests, meds, procedures without guidelines? Or are the guidelines very liberal? Or, are there people turned down/denied because their diagnosis doesn't meet the criteria for coverage?

My husband's experience with Canadian healthcare isn't fabulous and I understand that it's dependent on your location in the country. I like the idea of no copays, free meds, etc...but I'm not interested in long waits to get in to see a doctor when I need or want to (preventative care).

And this is also what American's are afraid will happen.

The other thing to consider is the fact that the American population is much much larger. I haven't heard a good explanation for where the money for this is going to come from and how much it's going to be. I already pay for my insurance and am not really interested in paying for other people's on top of it. Which is what it sounds like since it will be a "choice"...keep your insurance or take the government's. In Canada it's across the board...everybody has the same thing. That makes more sense to me.

[trailmix 77]

How is Canada's healthcare coverage different from Medicare and Medicaid? Do they let the doctors order tests, meds, procedures without guidelines? Or are the guidelines very liberal? Or, are there people turned down/denied because their diagnosis doesn't meet the criteria for coverage?

It's different in that there is no 'qualifying' - I can only speak about Alberta Health Care - there are slight variations depending on the Province - but everyone is covered. In fact in Alberta you must register. Now you can opt out if you want to...don't know why you would.

We pay no fees currently, the fee was $88 per month for families - but they scrapped that over a year ago. Completely funded through taxation.

There is no 'criteria' for coverage, if there are guidelines for tests that can be ordered etc - I have never heard of this - it is a non-issue.

Is there a ceiling on some things - yes. I know here in Calgary they have a private company that does knee replacements and they capped it last year. I believe that got sorted out.

I like the idea of no copays, free meds, etc...but I'm not interested in long waits to get in to see a doctor when I need or want to (preventative care).

And this is also what American's are afraid will happen.

Again, I can't speak about other Provinces - but in Alberta there are no 'free meds'. It's a common misconception. Dental, vision and drugs are not covered under Alberta Health care - however most employers offer add ons for these at a very reasonable rate.

There are many walk in clinics here - my Mother has her regular Doctor she sees every three months - it's not a problem. If she needs an appt. inbetween - they will see her. Are there Dr. shortages in some places - yes.

The other thing to consider is the fact that the American population is much much larger. I haven't heard a good explanation for where the money for this is going to come from and how much it's going to be. I already pay for my insurance and am not really interested in paying for other people's on top of it. Which is what it sounds like since it will be a "choice"...keep your insurance or take the government's. In Canada it's across the board...everybody has the same thing. That makes more sense to me.

I have never understood this argument. You mention you have medicaid and medicare - who pays for that? You do. Basically what you have is kind of a hodge podge of unequal care for all - well not really all. If an uninsured person goes to the hospital - you pay for that too. The only thing that will change is that the people who cannot currently afford insurance will not have to skulk in to some treatment center like they are second class citizens.

While the very poor and the elderly may qualify for those programs - what about the working poor - they don't qualify and cannot afford premiums. The U.S., in some places - gives the illusion that health care insurance is available to all at a reasonable cost. Well I looked in to this in Florida when we first arrived - after seeing commercials on television about how the people talked and the government is listening!

Yeah, well, high deductible is around $400 a month - that is not affordable for a lot of people.

I believe the reason they are offering American's two different options is because a lot of people are scared. I don't know how that will equate to you paying for your own and everyone elses too?

Edited August 13, 2009 by trailmix

[SapphireDreams 71]

^^ Great explanation TrailMix

I personally had a phenomenal experience with Canadian healthcare. I had no problem finding a family Dr. and don't know anyone that has. Never waited longer than about 4 hours in the emergency room (which I think it is typically fair considering all I did was cut my finger, I wasn't dying or anything) and all of my relatives who have had major surgery or treatment/care have been treated promptly and effectively.

My cousin was diagnosed with brain cancer 2 years ago. She was given 6-12 months to live. She was immediately admitted to one of the best cancer facilities in Canada (Princess Margaret) and she had brain surgery, completed multiple sessions of chemo and radiation and never paid a penny. She never once had to worry about insurance or cost or anything. Yes, she had access to the hospital (she lived in Toronto) but either way, she was treated like a princess and is now in full remission and is fine. To top things off, she was just about to graduate University, so technically she was almost off her parent's insurance (for prescriptions) and yet they still paid for everything since she couldn't graduate on time since she was sick. I don't even want to know what it would've been like for her to have to deal with insurance companies.

Same thing with my grandmother after she had a stroke... great treatment and care, no waiting and absolutely no insurance or hospital bills to worry about.

I think it's a shame that people have the mindset that, "I pay for my own insurance, why should I pay for everyone else too?" Like Trailmix mentioned, you already are! Why not find ways to make it more efficient, more fair for everyone? I don't think that the US could ever be like Canada, but I think that there is a broken system and something needs to change before things just keep getting worse. Dr.'s spend so much time and energy on malpractice lawsuits and insurance companies - it's not like that in Canada and it seems a lot more efficient.

[SonoranSongbird 3]

My husband, likewise, has had no problems with health care in Alberta.

One big difference between Edmonton and the community the OP describes is size. I live in a small town in rural Illinois and there are not a lot of doctors to choose from. Fortunately, we are 35 miles from St Louis, which has several very good hospitals, so if either of us ever needs any highly specialized care, we will be able to get it. We do also have a GP we like--but he is out of network for our health plan so we pay extra to see him.

The worst place I lived was Springfield, Illinois. I have insurance---at that time I even had really good insurance---but when I got bronchitis shortly after moving to Illinois I could not find a doctor willing to take new patients without scheduling an appointment 2 to 3 months in advance. Well, d'oh, I needed to get an antibiotic THAT DAY.

I know that is a problem in parts of Canada just as it is here, so having universal health care is not going to solve that particular problem. But it will solve other problems.

As to cost, that varies considerably from region to region, so it is not surprising that people have such varying experiences. For us, an office visit costs $130. Because our insurance company has a contract with our doctor limiting what he can charge, it is reduced to $52 if we have not yet met our deductible. Once we meet it, the insurance company pays 80% and we pay 20. They would pay 90% if we went to an in-network doctor. A lot of plans are better than that, a lot of other plans are not as good. When I lived in southern California, I had no insurance. I had a doctor who was willing to see me for $60. I don't know what his full charge would be. He said he could afford to charge less because he did not have to deal with medical billing companies and the mountains of red tape they entail, but in all honesty I think he just did it out of the goodness of his heart. He'd charge even less if it was something simpler.

[Carlawarla 1]

I have declined to participate in on-line discussions about Health Care up to now. I can say for certain that I espouse the belief that everyone, no matter what their economic status, no matter what the colour of their skin, no matter whether they be urban or rural, no matter what their political beliefs, or sexual orientation, or any other such "divisive" term we corral people into, should be afforded the same health care as anyone else. I would prefer that this be covered in all of our taxes. I would prefer that no one has to pay any health insurance to any private company. I am willing to pay more taxes so that everyone is covered. I believe that no one should ever be denied health coverage because of pre-exisiting conditions. The end.

[Sprailenes 47]

I'm with Carla on this one. Well said!

[sly_wolf 199]

Coming from Quebec, I can say healthcare there sux. Many do not have a family doctor and getting a test .... well you can just wait. My personal experiance in NY so far has been much better, although we are lucky to have insurance. It costs a bit with the co-pays and hopefully we dont ever need anything major .... or worse ... lose insurance. I hope the politicians here can get their act together and stop the fear mongering thats going on .... its so irritating.

[thetreble 19]

Social health care will never work in the US, nor will a one-party system.

The word of choice here is REFORM. Make it affordable.

[DeadPoolX 9]

Social health care will never work in the US, nor will a one-party system.

The word of choice here is REFORM. Make it affordable.

The United States and Canada are two very different countries when concerning health care. There are multiple reasons -- some major and others minor -- why the health care system in Canada would not work in the U.S. That said, even a small amount of reform might help many out.

Edited August 14, 2009 by DeadPoolX

[trailmix 77]

Social health care will never work in the US, nor will a one-party system.

The word of choice here is REFORM. Make it affordable.

That said, even a small amount of reform might help many out.

[Udella&Wiz 325]

I have declined to participate in on-line discussions about Health Care up to now. I can say for certain that I espouse the belief that everyone, no matter what their economic status, no matter what the colour of their skin, no matter whether they be urban or rural, no matter what their political beliefs, or sexual orientation, or any other such "divisive" term we corral people into, should be afforded the same health care as anyone else. I would prefer that this be covered in all of our taxes. I would prefer that no one has to pay any health insurance to any private company. I am willing to pay more taxes so that everyone is covered. I believe that no one should ever be denied health coverage because of pre-exisiting conditions. The end.

Here Here - well said Carla. I am with you 100%

[TdotGirl 0]

I agree with SapphireDreams - Great explanation TrailMix

And well said Carla and Treble

The current healthcare system is absolutely and inhumanly pathetic and saddens me deeply - so a change is mos def needed!!!

[Marilyn. 340]

from the little I understand about this I don't think they are purposing to make the US health care system exactly like the Canadian system...

[thetreble 19]

from the little I understand about this I don't think they are purposing to make the US health care system exactly like the Canadian system...

Yeah I don't think so either, Mar. You should hear some of the town hall discussions going on in Jersey about it though. People are so misinformed about universal healthcare in general.

One guy shouted out, "If you think this country is going to accept some sort of pre-WW2 Germany era-like system, youa re wrong!"

I was just sitting on the couch doing one of these...

[domegirl1978 1]

I'm from Montreal and I have to say that we have a major lack of family doctors and specialists here now in this province. I personally have never had a real problem with my healthcare. In fact, I must say I've been pretty damn satisfied with it. Yes, sometimes it takes a little longer to get an appt. with some of my specialists but I personally don't have anything SO wrong with me physically that I could not wait a little longer than others with more sever injuries.

Just like Sapphire said, I've been to the emergency room with cuts and breaks and I was not dying so it didn't bother me that I waited longer than people with really severe injuries. I believe someone who has a broken neck definitely should be seen before someone with a cut.

I've had to have 3 major surgeries from the age of 20-25. The first 2 were bunionectomies and I waited about 4 months for each surgery from the time the surgeon saw me. I found that to be reasonable.

In Sept. of 2002 I had to have emergency throat surgery and I was treated IMMEDIATELY in the emergency room. The doctor who operated on me literally saved my life. He said 8 more hours and I would have been dead. They treated me so well.

There will always be issues with any system. No system is perfect. But when I lived in the States as a kid, our medical bills were RIDICULOUS. Thank God we moved back to Canada and my sister had her kidney surgery here because if she had done it in Florida it would have cost my parents 130,000$. I feel for the poor kids that have to suffer because their parents can't afford it.

Changes will definitely need to be made to the U.S. system no matter what happens.