Ever had doubts?

[Hugglebuggles 60]

Krikit- My husband happened to see your sig as I was writing a post the other day and he was like, "I LOVE THAT PICTURE!"

My mom said the same thing!

[Krikit 1,164]

Now I can say that everybody and their mother has seen it!

[lgg 2]

What? You were just scrolling by??? God, i was writing some friggin' mind blowing stuff out there, Trailmix...

Geez...

No problem! Your post still makes me giggle -- I am a very simple girl. Plus having my posts be unreadable is slightly counterproductive.

Dunno about that guy who pays for everything though, who knows what kind of shenanigans he'd want in return.

Yay! I was just scrolling past your posts really fast

[cheeky monkey]

Um, Krikit...

Are you sure this comment doesn't belong in the stripper thread?

[/cheeky monkey}

Now I can say that everybody and their mother has seen it!

[firefly_chaser 0]

Well I hope it works out for you two. If you see issues with finances and such arrising now, and you just think it may be too stressful, just take it day by day. But you will have to decide for YOURSELF if this move is what YOU want and what's in the best interest for the two of you in the long run.

[moni_calla 0]

Now I can say that everybody and their mother has seen it!

[Skillmare 0]

Hey everyone. I am Lee, the "immature guy" discussed by Leighann.

I love Leighann to death. We both have issues -- mentally and financially -- that we have to work out. There are so many things that have gone wrong in both of our lives, and sometimes it's hard to see the light at the end of the tunnel.

The reason I am in debt? I am a very responsible person, have held the same job for 4 years now (haven't really been ambitious and screwed up going to college; it is currently on hold, and could be for a few more years)... but I got a 2008 Mustang GT in late 2007. In August of 2008, I had an awful crash, one that totaled my car, nearly killed me, had me in the hospital for over 2 weeks (collapsed lung, fractured wrist, chest tubes). I live in Florida and Geico was my insurance company. I did not have uninsured motorist coverage, nor health insurance, and the man who hit me (and it was his fault) did not have insurance and was driving on a suspended California license. As you can imagine, Geico only paid $10,000 in my hospital bills, paid my car off (did not give me a replacement or anything), and considered themselves done with he situation. As a result, I have a LARGE (over $55,000) hospital debt attached to all the credit bureaus. Anyone who tells you that "hospital debt doesn't matter" is wrong, for this has substantially hurt and forced my credit to drop dramatically. Further, and something that hurts me more, is that I was out of work for over two months. Ford Credit (the company which I got the loan from) was paid by Geico 3 months after the accident. Ford Credit told me they would put a hold on late payments for a few months because they understood my situation (generic e-mail). I called and talked to them, and they offered me no such service. As a result, they also put a delinquency on my credit file.

None of this was my fault. (I hate to sound so cliche...) The accident happened for a reason. I honestly couldn't comprehend the reason. I don't believe in fate, though I am a slightly religious person... but Leighann does. Growing up, I grew into disliking my father. To make a long story short, he was an alcoholic and one time I tried to commit suicide. I told my mother after taking an overdose of medicine and I was saved. Every once in a while I would have suicidal thoughts, but only once did I ever act upon it -- and I was 15. But after my accident, after it was all said and done... I was having a hard time with everything. I had no car, I lost my highly enjoyed car, and I was out of work and constantly being mailed letters from Shands. I had a decent amount of painkillers and seriously was thinking I should have died in the accident. I thought about taking them... but I didn't.

I only mention all of this because Leighann saved my life. We knew each other a little bit back in March of 2008. We talked to each other on vent, and I had a strong feeling about her, and she had one for me. After my accident, I spent a lot of time doing nothing online because it was all I could do. My wrist was fractured and hurt (and does to this day still) so I couldn't play WoW seriously... so I played casually. And Leighann and I played together, despite being enemy players. We talked on vent (think phone if you're not sure what it is), shared e-mail, she wanted me to make a MySpace/Facebook... I called her when she was at work. We talked all the time. We did that for months.

I try to talk to Leighann daily, in any way I can. Am I controlling? No, not really. Do I question her? Yeah, when I'm curious. We are very honest with each other. For the life of me, I don't know why we argue half the time. Leighann is probably the most honest person I have met. I sometimes have asked her things to see her answer, and even when it's an answer I don't like... she tells it to me. I just assumed that same courtesy should be applied to me. When she goes out with friends, which I confess is not often, I just feel bad because I can't be there with her. She is very beautiful, I tell her every day... the thought of guys looking at her without me there bothers me. It should, as far as I am concerned. But, as I have said, we both have mental issues to work out. I don't get mad that she's going out, that's not the whole story. I can't explain it all because I do not wish to invade Leighann's private life on the Internet.

She didn't talk to me for a decent amount of time. We eventually started talking to each other in February. Her friend was taking a vacation in Florida, about 4 hours from me, and we decided to meet. So we did. As I said, I was not in a good place financially (I had to put $1,000 to get a new car in late '08 as well, putting me farther behind). I didn't care. I was happy when I was with her. I drove down there multiple times and loved driving down there. Opened my mind, gave me something to look forward to. The best driving I have ever had, way better than driving fast in a sports car. But while Leighann and I spent time together... I was careless. I didn't care, I was having a great time with her. I bought her many things, and she 'forced' me to buy things for myself. Besides the Mustang GT, I almost refuse to spend things on myself. (Well, besides building my own PC, I guess) She made me feel good about myself again...and I loved her for it. I probably spent around $800 when I was with her. I didn't care. I don't care. I had a great time.

Her friend had some issues, and they were fighting. I took her back to my place and bought her a plane ticket to Buffalo. She had a way back, but she was stressed out about it. I didn't want her to be stressed. Even if I didn't have the money, there was no way I was going to let her ride with people she was having issues with. So I spent money on the ticket. Again, I do not regret this, and I would do it again in a heartbeat.

The next time she came down, she bought her ticket. She stayed at my place. We didn't spend a lot of money. We had an awesome time. I loved every minute of her being down here. I can see myself waking up with her every morning. I love the look she gives me, the stare in her eyes. I know she sees the love I have for her. This is not petty, childish, immature love. This is two human beings liking everything about each other to the point of... I don't even have words to describe. I'd die for Leighann. I'd change anything about myself to be with her. I would give her a kidney. It honestly does not matter. She is literally my everything.

The whole "he's making me pay for the visa" thing is simply not true. And I don't say this to make anyone think I am not some #######. It's just that it's her perspective. My perspective of the situation is this: She mentioned moving to America. She wants to live in Florida. She likes the beaches, I live here, and she wants a man to love her like I do. I am NOT saying I don't want her to move down here, but I was not rushing the situation. She mentioned it, she made the date; I was ecstatic that she wanted to be here as soon as she said. I mean, I'm not going to say "slow down" to her! I want her to be here with me. But I am a responsible man, I think, and since I cannot pay the visa it was not even on my mind. I have to pay, in just bills, $1300 a month to just live. My car, insurance, health insurance, cable, electric, rent, cell phone (contracted). I have 'roomates' and that's my baseline payment every month. Not to mention gas, food, or other expenses. Leighann doesn't have those burdens thankfully. We 'agreed' (or so I thought) that it would be best for her to spend her money on it since she has the ability to due to more free money.

It's not like I said, "I'm not paying for anything. If you want to be with me, move down here and pay for it yourself." If I had the money, I'd pay for it. I paid for her subscription for WoW, much like I pay for the very small ventrilo server, so that we could spend time together. It's how we talk, communicate. It's not like I'm paying for something that is a waste, in my opinion. Without WoW, we're in a rough situation and have to rely on subjects that will just end up making us sad.

I don't want to control Leighann's money. I give her my credit card, my banking information; everything. She doesn't use it, but I want her to know she can, that I trust her. I have nothing to hide from her. Never will. She bought me a game that I wanted. I was sort of rude about it because I told her that she should have bought me a webcam so that she could see me. I didn't mean to be rude, it just came out that way. I could download the game illegally (not that I really agree with that...but you know how it is) and would much rather her be able to see my face every day... I thought it would be a good way to connect. Sadly, we argued about this as well, as we didn't see eye-to-eye about it. In retrospect, I should have just been grateful she cared and wanted to make me happy instead of me wanting to make her happy.

As for Leighann's money... well, yeah, I will not lie. I was upset when Leighann got fish. Not because she spent her money how she wanted, but because I want the best thing for her. It's a hard concept to grasp and I can see how it seems controlling... but spending that kind of money when you need it just isn't financially sound to me. Yes, I told Leighann this, and yes, after she said I was immature I told her she was bad with money. It wasn't my intention to retaliate, but I just want her to be happy. Financially, she is hurting. I want to help her get out of it, and she sees me as a hindrance and thinks I am controlling her money. I don't mind her spending money on herself -- if she was here, I'd spend my money on her! Whatever she wants, she will get with me. She knows this is true, I have no desire for anything but to make her happy.

I am so hurt right now. We have talked very little since this topic was created (which I just happened to read for the first time, and it saddened me greatly). It's been about a month. It's a rough time... but I love her, I want to be with her. I don't like how she can ignore me like I don't exist. When I told her "I don't want to talk about it" in relations to the visa, it was because I didn't want to argue, not because I wanted to ignore her. But... I'm struggling so much emotionally. I've thought long and hard...how can someone claim to love me, yet only to ignore my very existence? I guess some outside help would be appreciated... can someone please give some incite to this? I send her text messages, she ignores them. I send her e-mails, she ignores them. She replies only to tell me that we're done or if she wants to answer something.

Am I seriously supposed to move on? I've never had a girl love me like Leighann. I've never loved a woman like I love Leighann. I cannot... I will not...just let her walk away. I love her unconditionally, and I just can't comprehend what has changed between us other than things that I cannot see, things beyond my control... is it really this cruel?

[Danu 19]

One thing that is most important in a relationship like this is communication about everything. Even if you fight about it, you need to be able to talk it out and not just brush off a subject to avoid that. Especially in a case where it affects both of your futures so greatly.

Wes and I both met online, through WoW. We both have issues in our pasts about being cheated on an trust. However being 3000 miles away I have NEVER in my whole life felt as secure as I do with Wes. I know he doesnt like too much when I go out, I don't go to the bars or anything though anymore for multiple reasons (I don't feel comfortable without him there and don't want to make him feel uncomfortable either) and if I go out somewhere else, he knows where I am going, when I will be back and who I am out with, and he can always reach me by phone. The same thing applies in reverse. It makes us both feel much more comfortable and because we understand what the other has been through its not a hardship to do this at all.

Wes isn't so great with his money but he has been trying to be as good as possible knowing that I am currently not working, which has strained move plans a bit but they aren't impossible. That said, I don't get mad if he gets food out now and then, I do it too every once and awhile. Theres a big thing about picking your battles. Its not something thats worth fighting over at all. If he was eating out every day again I would probably talk to him about it as I did before, but I also talk to him, I dont get mad at him about it. There are things that are more important at the end of the day than one day out as a treat to yourself once in awhile.

Now about the visa costs. Most of us split it because we could. The one thing I did mention to her before was that the money for the application has to come from a US bank, so either you would have to pay it from your money, or she would have to wire it to you to have it paid. In the end it doesn't really matter who pays for it as long as its agreed upon and both people are happy with the outcome.

Love is a wonderful thing and I know exactly what you mean about that look. But being in love isnt enough. You HAVE to be able to talk about money (both of you!!!) without feeling the divide of his stuff/her stuff. Its working towards a future for both of you. Unless you can sit down and talk about the important issues you will find it a hard struggle, even couples from the same towns have issues like this. I think she is probably hurting because you said you didn't want to talk about it, which if it were me would make me think you didn't care about our future, that you just could brush it off like that. If shes decided you are done and will not talk to you at all about anything then unfortunately for the moment I don't think theres much you can do. I do hope for both of your sakes that you can sit down and talk about this though, and maybe everything will work out fine, but you may want to take your time this time (don't be afraid to tell her you aren't ready financially yet to be able to get her down there...the best things are worth the wait!)

[Jauque 1]

I am so hurt right now. We have talked very little since this topic was created (which I just happened to read for the first time, and it saddened me greatly). It's been about a month. It's a rough time... but I love her, I want to be with her. I don't like how she can ignore me like I don't exist. When I told her "I don't want to talk about it" in relations to the visa, it was because I didn't want to argue, not because I wanted to ignore her. But... I'm struggling so much emotionally. I've thought long and hard...how can someone claim to love me, yet only to ignore my very existence? I guess some outside help would be appreciated... can someone please give some incite to this? I send her text messages, she ignores them. I send her e-mails, she ignores them. She replies only to tell me that we're done or if she wants to answer something.

It sounds like you've both had some tough breaks, maybe right now isn't the best time to be hopping into a marriage. (I'm sure this has been mentioned before but 2000$ is a drop in the bucket as far as immigration ccosts go.)

From my experience if a person wants to be with you they don't ignore you for a month. They reply to your texts and e-mails and they either contact you apologizing or contact you angry hoping that you will apologize. My only piece of advice: Hate is not the opposite of love, apathy is the opposite of love.

Best of luck!

[Carlawarla 1]

Skillmare, I DO know what it means to find that special someone who you can't imagine not living without. All of us here do. Unfortunately, when only one person posts here, it's difficult to get the "true" picture, and it's why (the old cliche!)...there are two sides to every story. At the same time, again, neither of you have posted your ages, but from the looks of your pictures, it would appear you're both very young. That doesn't mean you don't know love, it does mean sometimes, and may or may not be in your case, that you're both "immature". The tone of your voice, saying things that are miscontrued, from both sides may have played a big part in how a lot of this has unfolded, but commuication is the key.

That being said, if she's not communicating with you, there is nothing that you can really do right now. Taking responsibility for your own behaviour is important, and perhaps writing that out, apologizing for your part in this (and it's not all your fault btw...), and then making some proposals on how you could move forward could be a way of getting her to respond in same. If she's not taking your calls, and only answering some of your emails, then writing a letter and mailing it, or emailing it, might be a way of opening communication again. Then leaving it...giving her time to respond in kind. You need to talk about how you can both either move forward from this point, and take lessons learned toward a future together, or bring some closure to this relationship.

Please let us know if you two do start communicating again, and I truly hope you can work things out. Working through this obstacle successfully can only bode well for future communications.

[thetreble 19]

Skillmare-

Carla is right. There are always two sides of every story. Moving to another country, marrying someone and being financially stable are three MASSIVE endeavors. If you love each other, that's great and maybe at some point, every thing else will fall into place. But, from what I have heard from both of you, having conflicts over webcams, online games and visa applications are so small in retrospect to the costs and emotional exhaustion of having a spouse move countries to be with you.

Again, this is not to say it won't ever happen...but maybe it is a good thing to just let it go for a little while at least. Many of us didn't have much money when we decided to take on this process, but many of us dated for long periods of time long distance and saved money. The costs you have incurred due to your health are a shame, and I'm sorry to hear about that. So, it would make sense to me to get those costs down and pay that debt down and then consider the Visa process.

Marriage is usually a massive step for most people, even if they live down the street from each other. We all have these extra burdens we have to carry in this process, whether it financial or emotional. Maybe it's time for you also to take a step back, re-open the lines of communication once things have settled, and then see where it goes from there. If your relationship is strong enough, you don't need to see each other every day for it to last. The waiting period will be worth it in the end and moving too soon, getting married too soon, could be a hindrance.

Good luck.

[baron555 934]

[iv heard people never change...and iv experienced this first hand with men. Do you think it's because of the distance that he argues with me like this? Or am I about to make a huge mistake?

Yes you are. Stop the entire process and see if your relationship is strong; it sounds like it is not. If you two are arguing now, you will argue forever. That is no relationship. If he really loves you, he will see the same. If he doesn't, then you two are not made for each other.

Do not give up hope or categorize all men; there are some very nice gentlemen out there that would love to be in a relationship with you.

Being married takes a lot of hard work from both parties. I wish you luck.

[lgg 2]

Aw, man...

I really hope she comes back and talks to you about it-- that is not right. Relationships are hard -- men and women are really different in how they process stuff like this and the distance and immigration does not help sometimes.

But, I do believe that when two people have a good, strong connection -- they tend to understand each other well and accept each other without having to niggle/naggle over every little thing, despite the communication boundaries surrounding emotions and whatnot that our sexes have set for us, you know?

Just my humble opinion. Also? I don't think it right for her to just go without a word -- that is unkind, to say the least. I agree with Jaucque (sp) when he/she said that hate is not the opposite of love, apathy is.

Good luck with everything. I do mean that. It's not easy, none of it but I am of the opinion that it is well worth it, lumps and all...

Best,

LGG

[SonoranSongbird 3]

I have not read the entire thread, but my 2 cents, for whatever it's worth, is this. It is possible to meet the right person and still marry them in the wrong time. This was the case for two friends of mine. They went through severl VERY TOUGH years before working things out and now have a truly wonderful marriage. I have other friends (well, actually, the wife of the couple is the one who gave me a link to visa journey so I won't go into much detail) who were a couple for something like 7 or 8 years before beginning their immigration process. I and my husband knew eachother for nearly 4 years before becoming a couple. One of my friends married her husband after she'd actually known him for 26 years (having met as teenagers).

You are both young, and waiting for your circumstances to improve before embarking on this journey will not deprive you of a lifetime together. I am in my 40s and my husband is in his 50s, and even at our age I don't regret the years we spent as friends (we were attracted to each other but neither acted on it because we both assumed the feeling was not mutual). In the scheme of things, that is very little time compared to the rest of our lives, and those years, like the ones that preceded them, were a part of us becoming who we both are as people.

If you put it on hold, too, it might take the pressure off of you and allow you to talk more freely so you can grow as a couple. I'm not saying waiting is definitely the answer for you. I don't know either of you and don't fully know your situation. But it is one option you should consider.

Best of luck to both of you, whether your future is together or not.

[Skillmare 0]

I agree communication is important, if not the most important. Leighann and I have had very good talks, discussions, and have been very open about many things in our lives. I've never opened up to anyone the way I have Leighann. I sometimes speak my mind without processing all the thoughts, but typically see every angle of an argument. Of course originally I see my side, as anyone does, but I ALWAYS admit and accept when I am wrong. I do not hesitate to apologize when I think I was brash, stupid, ignorant, or wrong. I pride myself on this, the honesty, and not trying to play the "blame game." I sometimes see both people at fault, and think that sometimes only I see it this way and that I have the burden of apologizing without receiving an apology. I don't let these things bother me, though, because I understand the human mind and not everyone thinks the same way. I am a writer myself; I express easily through text, words... speaking is not my strongest point in the blur of the moment. Speaking after thinking is not that difficult, to put thoughts into expressions...

But as it is now, it's really hard. Leighann talked to me very, very briefly last night and told me exactly what happened, how her views of me changed. And I truthfully don't get it. I understand how she could be angry at me over the argument, but as I explained to her, there are things she does that I don't like but usually ignore because I accept her for who and what she is. To stop loving someone, to start to dislike them, over a petty (my opinion) argument seems wrong. I was wrong in how I treated her, I completely confess and admit to this. And I won't lie, it wouldn't be the first time I treated her that way -- but it was not hateful towards her. It's not like I killed her cat, fish, or best friend. It's not like I cheated on her, told her lies, or intentionally hurt her feelings. It was nothing like that. I hate thinking this way...but it honestly just does not seem logical to change the way you love someone over this. I feel like...like...something else is out there, something else caused this, and that she's not telling me. I feel like it's too trivial to be this simplistic...and yet, Leighann does not lie. She hasn't lied to me. This has to be the reason...

Sadly, Leighann is not a very forgiving person. I am religious, as I said, so it is "in my blood." Forgiveness is something that I feel every human being needs. People make mistakes. Sometimes people make the same mistakes. If you cannot forgive people, then everyone is bad, evil, and you'd be alone for the rest of your life. I have forgiven Leighann on so many occasions, probably more than she even knows, and she has only apologized to me perhaps 3 times that I can recall. I have apologized to her so many times, and I always mean it. I have changed many things for Leighann, things I would have never changed for any other person on earth that I've ever known. I would change anything for Leighann, and she sadly thinks people can't change.

People can change. I've changed since knowing her, being with her, loving her. If you asked anyone who has ever known me, they could easily tell you that I have been happier this past year than I have been my whole life. In that same token, during this hard process people could also tell you I've been so stressed, bothered, and care deeply for Leighann. I can understand Leighann not expecting people to change because of everything she has been through... but all those men before me..they none loved her. They don't care about her like I do. They didn't want to please her like I do. They were the types of guys that make women hate men. And it bothers me to be categorized like that, and yet... I can't change the mind of a person, nor can I show them the changes I will make when she wont accept me.

[JillA 2]

Sorry for what you're going through, Skillmare... but unfortunately in my own personal experience, people don't really change. They can try to change, but changing as a person is difficult and one often goes back to how they were before. Old behaviours come back after the "change" period has worn off.... I'm not saying you need to change as I don't know you or your situation, I just know it's very difficult for people to change who they are/how they act.

It sounds like Lee just needs space... unfortuntely you can't "make" someone be with you or love you, as much as it hurts.