Living and working in Canada...

[Der Bücherwurm 1]

I'm getting worried about the economy in the states and wondering if it's ever going to turn around. So I thought I might think about a move to Canada later on if the US continues it's downward spiral since that's where my fiance's family will immigrate to later on.

I've been to Alberta on vacation and I realize that Canada is more socialist but I thought some Canuck's could give more insight on what the worklife is like. Do Canucks live to work like Americans or are there more worker's rights there? I've lived in Germany and Norway so would you say it compares to their system? I realize that Canucks will take the piss out of me for being American but I want my husband to have a nice life since he's had a bit of a hard time in the ME.

What would you consider to be the pros and cons of life in Canada? I realize the weather would be a minus as that was Norway's drawback too.

[thetreble 19]

You have to keep in mind that when the economic situation gets bad in the US, Canada usually follows suit. They just announced mass job layoffs in Canada yesterday that would soon come to fruition.

I work the same amount of hours now that I did when I worked for the government in Canada. I also got taxed the same amount as I get taxed here on my pay checks. I live in the North East so I do find more people are over-dedicated to the jobs and work-aholics, but that is really their choice.

As far as worker's rights...we have unions just like the US has unions. So in my opinion the worker's rights are the same.

I've never lived in Germany or Norway so I can't tell you if Canada compares to those few places. I have heard many people compare it to Sweden, Norway and Finland though.

The weather is all dependent on where you live, as well.

Pros: Safe environment, Access to government monitored healthcare, nice people, quite a few big cities and quite a few small towns...very clean. Nice things to see and many vacation spots. Relatively inexpensive post-secondary education and good public schools.

Cons: Weather, depending on where you live...dealing with healthcare wait times can be hard as well as finding a family doctor depending on where you live. Canadian weather can be hard on your cars. High gas prices (although not as high as places in europe) I'm sure there are a few others.

Canada is a wonderful place, but I'm a little biased. The thing is though, there are a lot of places in Canada that are small and jobs can be hard to find. In this economy, it may be even harder.

[Emancipation 2]

I'd recommend doing a little more traveling in Canada before moving there. It's just as diverse as the US. What happens in Alberta (and their economy) right now is waaaay different than in other parts of the country.. Salaries are not as high say in the Maritimes (where many people are leaving right now to go out west for work), but the standard of living, and cost of living is considerably higher in the East (in my humble but accurate opinion )... but then there is the West coast, which boasts LOADS of pristine beauty and a COMPLETELY different outlook on life (from what I've experienced).. then there is the heart of the country (ONT & QB) which would be fiercely lobbied here as well as the best part of our Nation..

It's a vast country.. there's the prairies and the North as well, which I didn't even mention cause I've never been.. but many many people love those areas, and would say they are the best Canada offers..

I agree with Treble.. as the US economy goes, so does Canada's though.. so don't think you'll escape it if you flee north.. NAFTA has tied our economies together

When push comes to shove though, you have a bigger safety net in Canada.. which is why it might be more advantageous to be there, but if things get really bad both countries will suffer from overburden on their social programs.

One question though - what you got that makes going to Canada possible? Are you a good candidate for immigration via the points system?

[thetreble 19]

One question though - what you got that makes going to Canada possible? Are you a good candidate for immigration via the points system?

That is another thing I was going to ask. If you are considering moving your entire family there, what immigration path would you decide to do?

[Der Bücherwurm 1]

For now are plans are just to go to the states in 1 yr. Hopefully things will improve in the economy. We're living in Dubai right now actually. I must say the financial crisis is pretty global at this point. Europe is in recession and it's begun to affect the UAE as well. My fiance's sister is currently working on her Master's in French in Paris. Once she graduates she plans on trying to immigrate to Quebec. If she's able to do that then she will bring their father and younger brother over if possible. My fiance is a Web Developer so that is something that's in demand even now in the US and Northern Europe. It just seems like the quality of life is better in northern Europe and Canada from what I hear. I'm not sure my fiance could handle the cold but I dealt with it in Norway for 2 yrs. so I know what to expect. Do you really pay the same amount in taxes in the states as you did in Canada? It doesn't seem worth it since you don't get as much back for your taxes in the states. I wish things would change in the states with regards to health coverage and vacation time. To be honest you work considerably more in Dubai and there are no social services but at least you can get 28 days vacation.

I'm sure we'll probly just end up in Colorado or Seattle, WA but I just want to get an idea of what the difference is in salary, quality of life, etc. in case Canada becomes a valid option later on.

[Emancipation 2]

I do pay aprox. the same in taxes as I did in Canada... I do live in CT though.. which has the highest rate of combined taxes (fed, state & local) in the Union apparently. A whole lotta taxes for a whole lotta nothing is the CT way!

Edited November 14, 2008 by Emancipation

[Der Bücherwurm 1]

I don't know about CT, but I've heard of Massachusetts referred to as Taxachusetts.

Would you guys say your standard of living has gone down since you don't get back as much from the taxes you pay in the states?

Don't get me wrong, compared to Dubai the US looks great. I'll never complain about the taxes I have to pay again because I see what I get back from it, even in the states. I think one problem in the US is we have too many people. The larger the population the harder it is to care for everyone like a couple with 8 kids instead of just 2. Norway has an easy time since they have a pretty homogeneous population of less than 5 million and are sitting on a payload of oil. I just prefer a safer, more laid back work to live lifestyle. Of course you can have that in small cities in the US, you just have to take whatever job is available and deal with the religious nutters.

[thetreble 19]

My vacation time is also the same. In fact I've been given more vacation time here at my government job in the US then I got in Canada at a similar job.

Salary differences depend on the occupation and the state. North east the salaries are higher but your cost of living is higher. It really has nothing to do with Canada VS America when it comes to money, in my opinion.

I love Canada, as it is my home. I just don't think you are going to find the opportunities you are under the impression you are going to find there. It is so small in comparison to the US, and before the economy went bust, the unemployment rate in Canada has always been higher for many reasons.

You also can't just move to Canada because you want to and if you want to move to Canada, then why bother moving to the US in the first place? It is going to cost you so much money and time.

Adjusting to life in one country is hard enough without adjusting to life in another.

[Emancipation 2]

Would you guys say your standard of living has gone down since you don't get back as much from the taxes you pay in the states?

Well i can't directly link it.. i don't think it's fair.. had I moved from a big city in Canada to here, perhaps, but I moved from small town Maritimes to crouching on NYC, armpit of CT area.. so that's a huge leap whether it be from small town middle America or from small town Canada...

I think my quality of life has gone down, but I wouldn't directly connect it to US vs. Canada. Nope.

[Der Bücherwurm 1]

That's true I guess. Hopefully my fiance and I will get enough vacation time to visit his family no matter where they end up. We just have to move where ever the IT jobs are which probly means the Northwestern US.

Edited November 14, 2008 by Hoomsfuturewife

[minnew 4]

That's true I guess. Hopefully my fiance and I will get enough vacation time to visit his family no matter where they end up. We just have to move where ever the IT jobs are which probly means the Northwestern US.

The most forgotten part of Canada is the prairies, I am still living in Canada and have seen a big time growth in my province and the city I live in. Years ago it used to be everyone moving to Alberta, well now those people are slowly moving back because the quality of life is better and the costs of living in the cities in Alberta have skyrocketed! There was actually a housing shortage in Saskatchewan! There are so many jobs in the province of Saskatchewan that are going untouched, we are experiencing a huge healthcare professional shortage (recruiting nurses from the Philipinnes) and also more interest in natural resources. Anyways, just my two cents, Saskatchewan is definitely worth some research.

[thetreble 19]

While I totally agree that Saskatchewan would be a place to look into, if you are not from Canada it may be scary for you to move to the prairies. It is so dead in the middle, if you have family in the far west or far east (where many people live) it may be long to travel to them. Also, as Canadians we know prairie winters can be reallllly to tough.

[SapphireDreams 71]

The economy in Canada is not doing so hot either. I work in the tech sector and alot of our clients are facing an economic downturn.

Sad but true

[jedinite 0]

I believe it all depends on what your skills are and what industry you intend on working for.

I am currently in Alberta right now and the economy is still booming. Perhaps not as much as it was a year or two ago but compared to the rest of the country it's done and is still doing better than most other provinces. This is due to the fact that most Oil & Gas companies are based in Alberta. Calgary to more specific.

If you can tolerate a cold Alberta winter then it's pretty good here. We are East of the Rockies and the start of the prairie provinces so you get to see the beautiful mountains and vast foothills.

In terms of taxes, income and cost of living, Alberta is very comparable to the States. One big benefit of Alberta is it's the only province that does not have a provincial sales tax. Only GST which is a governmental sales tax. So instead of paying 5% GST plus 6 to 8.5% PST, you're only going to pay 5% on all goods and services. The tax savings on salaries are also very progressive. Alberta has been running in surplus for several years and has even given Albertan residents cash back from the surplus, I wasn't here to receive it but I believe it was $450 or something. Health care is more privatized in Alberta, so in that aspect it's also more similar to the US.

I assume that you work in Oil & Gas since you are working in Dubai right now. So you'll feel quite at home in Calgary's job place. A lot of the Oil & Gas companies offer benefits beyond salary, such as every second Friday off. And working in Canada vs the US is a bit different too. In the US you can expect to work more and longer, I've know people to work 6 days a week and put in over 75hours a week. In Canada, the most you'll be asked to work is 44hrs, but for most places it's 38.5 to 40 hours a week. Of course if you have a lot of work you need catching up on you'll probably go in on your own to catch up. But at least lifestyle-wise, working in Canada is more relaxed and less stressful compared to US counterparts.

One drawback of Alberta is culture though. There is a culture here, and it's not all "cowboys" as a lot of Eastern Canadians tend to think, but it is also not too far off from being all yeehaw. Alberta is quite a bit more "Caucasian" than other parts of the country, though I've noticed a lot more visible minorities in the last year than I did 7 years ago when I left to work in the US. You won't get the same nightlife and experience as living in Toronto or Montreal. You pretty much have to go out of your way to find culture and arts in Calgary or Edmonton.

If you are planning to leave the US because of economic reasons then I would say look into Calgary for careers as there is still a lot of unfilled jobs here and it won't take you long to find one. This economic turn down won't hit everyone, and it won't last forever. There's still a lot of opportunities in the US for skilled workers and professionals, it's the blue collar workers that get hit the first and the hardest in economic slowdowns.

Good luck with your decision.

[trailmix 77]

I doubt that a web developer would be an 'in demand' occupation in Canada - and I also doubt it would be grounds for immigration based on shortage.

jedinite, I don't think you can say that Alberta's cost of living compares to the U.S.. The United States is a very big place and the cost of living has a huge huge variation (as it does within Canada).

Also, 'private' health care in Alberta is still against the law. While they might have private clinics for lasik - you can't go to a private clinic to get your leg set.

I also think it would be a good idea for you to check it out yourself Hooms, good luck.

Edited November 14, 2008 by trailmix