Do we need a marriage certificate from the U.S.?

[teddy000 0]

My husband and I got married in India and we have a marriage certificate from India. Do we need to register our wedding in the U.S. as well? Would our certificate from India be acceptable there? Thanks.

[redglasses 1]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Edited August 11, 2008 by redglasses

[pushbrk 12,824]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Huh? Embassy Notarize a marriage certificate? Not likely, since US Notaries witness signatures and any legal marriage certificate would already be signed. We have a certified translation of our marriage certificate, a copy of which was filed with the I-130 and I-129F petitions as required. Whatever will satisfy USCIS and the Consulate that you are legally married will suffice for any other concern in the US.

[Ling Ling 22]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Huh? Embassy Notarize a marriage certificate? Not likely, since US Notaries witness signatures and any legal marriage certificate would already be signed. We have a certified translation of our marriage certificate, a copy of which was filed with the I-130 and I-129F petitions as required. Whatever will satisfy USCIS and the Consulate that you are legally married will suffice for any other concern in the US.

While it may not be necessary (sure can't hurt), the Embassy can, will and do notarize translated marriage certificates.

[pushbrk 12,824]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Huh? Embassy Notarize a marriage certificate? Not likely, since US Notaries witness signatures and any legal marriage certificate would already be signed. We have a certified translation of our marriage certificate, a copy of which was filed with the I-130 and I-129F petitions as required. Whatever will satisfy USCIS and the Consulate that you are legally married will suffice for any other concern in the US.

While it may not be necessary (sure can't hurt), the Embassy can, will and do notarize translated marriage certificates.

"Notarize". Just what is the Notary attesting to?

[Ling Ling 22]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Huh? Embassy Notarize a marriage certificate? Not likely, since US Notaries witness signatures and any legal marriage certificate would already be signed. We have a certified translation of our marriage certificate, a copy of which was filed with the I-130 and I-129F petitions as required. Whatever will satisfy USCIS and the Consulate that you are legally married will suffice for any other concern in the US.

While it may not be necessary (sure can't hurt), the Embassy can, will and do notarize translated marriage certificates.

"Notarize". Just what is the Notary attesting to?

They certify/attest to the validity of the signature (identity) and date of the translation.

It's really difficult to get the tone of your question from e-mail...but it appears somewhat adversarial and sarcastic per se.

Please elaborate.

[payxibka 10,045]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Huh? Embassy Notarize a marriage certificate? Not likely, since US Notaries witness signatures and any legal marriage certificate would already be signed. We have a certified translation of our marriage certificate, a copy of which was filed with the I-130 and I-129F petitions as required. Whatever will satisfy USCIS and the Consulate that you are legally married will suffice for any other concern in the US.

While it may not be necessary (sure can't hurt), the Embassy can, will and do notarize translated marriage certificates.

"Notarize". Just what is the Notary attesting to?

They certify/attest to the validity of the signature (identity) and date of the translation.

It's really difficult to get the tone of your question from e-mail...but it appears somewhat adversarial and sarcastic per se.

Please elaborate.

I think the question is how is this signature attestation adding "value" to the document, particularly if the person whose signature is being attested to has no recognized authority.....

[pushbrk 12,824]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Huh? Embassy Notarize a marriage certificate? Not likely, since US Notaries witness signatures and any legal marriage certificate would already be signed. We have a certified translation of our marriage certificate, a copy of which was filed with the I-130 and I-129F petitions as required. Whatever will satisfy USCIS and the Consulate that you are legally married will suffice for any other concern in the US.

While it may not be necessary (sure can't hurt), the Embassy can, will and do notarize translated marriage certificates.

"Notarize". Just what is the Notary attesting to?

They certify/attest to the validity of the signature (identity) and date of the translation.

It's really difficult to get the tone of your question from e-mail...but it appears somewhat adversarial and sarcastic per se.

Please elaborate.

I think the question is how is this signature attestation adding "value" to the document, particularly if the person whose signature is being attested to has no recognized authority.....

You might see the question as adversarial. I'm challenging you to think about what value is added by any contemplated "notarization" by a Consular official. They don't provide translation services and don't attest to the validity of a translation and they certainly cannot attest to who signed the already issued certificate.

US Consular officers can notarize documents alright but they serve the same function as a domestic Notary, in that they attest to signatures. Nobody is going to be signing a marriage certificate at a US Consulate and only a signature witnessed by a Notary in real time can be "notarized".

In China, they do use "Notarial Translation" services in that the government Notarial office provides and attests to official translation of official documents. Their function is entirely different from that of a US Notary or Consular Officer's notarial charter.

Edited August 12, 2008 by pushbrk

[Ling Ling 22]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Huh? Embassy Notarize a marriage certificate? Not likely, since US Notaries witness signatures and any legal marriage certificate would already be signed. We have a certified translation of our marriage certificate, a copy of which was filed with the I-130 and I-129F petitions as required. Whatever will satisfy USCIS and the Consulate that you are legally married will suffice for any other concern in the US.

While it may not be necessary (sure can't hurt), the Embassy can, will and do notarize translated marriage certificates.

"Notarize". Just what is the Notary attesting to?

They certify/attest to the validity of the signature (identity) and date of the translation.

It's really difficult to get the tone of your question from e-mail...but it appears somewhat adversarial and sarcastic per se.

Please elaborate.

I think the question is how is this signature attestation adding "value" to the document, particularly if the person whose signature is being attested to has no recognized authority.....

You might see the question as adversarial. I'm challenging you to think about what value is added by any contemplated "notarization" by a Consular official. They don't provide translation services and don't attest to the validity of a translation and they certainly cannot attest to who signed the already issued certificate.

US Consular officers can notarize documents alright but they serve the same function as a domestic Notary, in that they attest to signatures. Nobody is going to be signing a marriage certificate at a US Consulate and only a signature witnessed by a Notary in real time can be "notarized".

In China, they do use "Notarial Translation" services in that the government Notarial office provides and attests to official translation of official documents. Their function is entirely different from that of a US Notary or Consular Officer's notarial charter.

The value is that they are verifying the identity and signature of the person who signs off as the translator and by the nature of the document (wedding certificate)

they are also authenticating said document as a true document. It could also be argued that it would be expected that the Consular officer would be bi-lingual, or at least have a competency in English and the native language of the Embassy, and therefore at least make a ministerial review of the documents, therefore giving

the document at least a smidgeon more credibility than if it were notarized by the clerk at the bank. Perhaps not enough for a court of law, but enough for a government adjudicator to not send an RFE

[pushbrk 12,824]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Huh? Embassy Notarize a marriage certificate? Not likely, since US Notaries witness signatures and any legal marriage certificate would already be signed. We have a certified translation of our marriage certificate, a copy of which was filed with the I-130 and I-129F petitions as required. Whatever will satisfy USCIS and the Consulate that you are legally married will suffice for any other concern in the US.

While it may not be necessary (sure can't hurt), the Embassy can, will and do notarize translated marriage certificates.

"Notarize". Just what is the Notary attesting to?

They certify/attest to the validity of the signature (identity) and date of the translation.

It's really difficult to get the tone of your question from e-mail...but it appears somewhat adversarial and sarcastic per se.

Please elaborate.

I think the question is how is this signature attestation adding "value" to the document, particularly if the person whose signature is being attested to has no recognized authority.....

You might see the question as adversarial. I'm challenging you to think about what value is added by any contemplated "notarization" by a Consular official. They don't provide translation services and don't attest to the validity of a translation and they certainly cannot attest to who signed the already issued certificate.

US Consular officers can notarize documents alright but they serve the same function as a domestic Notary, in that they attest to signatures. Nobody is going to be signing a marriage certificate at a US Consulate and only a signature witnessed by a Notary in real time can be "notarized".

In China, they do use "Notarial Translation" services in that the government Notarial office provides and attests to official translation of official documents. Their function is entirely different from that of a US Notary or Consular Officer's notarial charter.

The value is that they are verifying the identity and signature of the person who signs off as the translator and by the nature of the document (wedding certificate)

they are also authenticating said document as a true document. It could also be argued that it would be expected that the Consular officer would be bi-lingual, or at least have a competency in English and the native language of the Embassy, and therefore at least make a ministerial review of the documents, therefore giving

the document at least a smidgeon more credibility than if it were notarized by the clerk at the bank. Perhaps not enough for a court of law, but enough for a government adjudicator to not send an RFE

So, you're describing a process where a translator takes the foreign marriage certificate and their translation to the US Consulate asking the Consular officer to witness their signature on the document certifying they translated the certificate?? I suppose that's possible if the translator is a US Citizen, able to avail themselves of US Citizen services inside a US Consulate. In no way does witnessing a signature attest to or add credibility to the accuracy of a translation. Consulates don't offer such translation services and would be forbidden from taking actions intended to give that impression.

Do you have any experience with actually doing this or is this just a theory you've ginned up in your own mind?

[Ling Ling 22]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Huh? Embassy Notarize a marriage certificate? Not likely, since US Notaries witness signatures and any legal marriage certificate would already be signed. We have a certified translation of our marriage certificate, a copy of which was filed with the I-130 and I-129F petitions as required. Whatever will satisfy USCIS and the Consulate that you are legally married will suffice for any other concern in the US.

While it may not be necessary (sure can't hurt), the Embassy can, will and do notarize translated marriage certificates.

"Notarize". Just what is the Notary attesting to?

They certify/attest to the validity of the signature (identity) and date of the translation.

It's really difficult to get the tone of your question from e-mail...but it appears somewhat adversarial and sarcastic per se.

Please elaborate.

I think the question is how is this signature attestation adding "value" to the document, particularly if the person whose signature is being attested to has no recognized authority.....

You might see the question as adversarial. I'm challenging you to think about what value is added by any contemplated "notarization" by a Consular official. They don't provide translation services and don't attest to the validity of a translation and they certainly cannot attest to who signed the already issued certificate.

US Consular officers can notarize documents alright but they serve the same function as a domestic Notary, in that they attest to signatures. Nobody is going to be signing a marriage certificate at a US Consulate and only a signature witnessed by a Notary in real time can be "notarized".

In China, they do use "Notarial Translation" services in that the government Notarial office provides and attests to official translation of official documents. Their function is entirely different from that of a US Notary or Consular Officer's notarial charter.

The value is that they are verifying the identity and signature of the person who signs off as the translator and by the nature of the document (wedding certificate)

they are also authenticating said document as a true document. It could also be argued that it would be expected that the Consular officer would be bi-lingual, or at least have a competency in English and the native language of the Embassy, and therefore at least make a ministerial review of the documents, therefore giving

the document at least a smidgeon more credibility than if it were notarized by the clerk at the bank. Perhaps not enough for a court of law, but enough for a government adjudicator to not send an RFE

So, you're describing a process where a translator takes the foreign marriage certificate and their translation to the US Consulate asking the Consular officer to witness their signature on the document certifying they translated the certificate?? I suppose that's possible if the translator is a US Citizen, able to avail themselves of US Citizen services inside a US Consulate. In no way does witnessing a signature attest to or add credibility to the accuracy of a translation. Consulates don't offer such translation services and would be forbidden from taking actions intended to give that impression.

Do you have any experience with actually doing this or is this just a theory you've ginned up in your own mind?

If you fully understood my first post in this thread, by saying "can, will, and do", it should be obvious that I speak from a direct experience.

So there's no reason for you to suppose...it IS possible.

I did not say that by a Consular officer notarizing a document that they are attesting to the accuracy of the translation. However, the Consular officer, without actually certifying the translation, does have an official responsibility to review the documents and to insure that they are not knowingly notarizing a fraudulent document,

or attaching the translation of a wedding certificate to a water bill (note, they do use a special device to bind the original and translation together as part of their notary process). As stated before, I would NOT expect to be able to argue that Consular notary is prima facie evidence of an accurate translation, but I do still have a very reasonable belief that an adjudicator would question a document notarized by a Consular officer, less than a couple of pieces of paper stapled together and stamped by the notary at Small Town Bank, inc.

[pushbrk 12,824]

You don't need to register your marriage because marriages which are legally performed and valid abroad are also legally valid in the US.

However, bring your marriage certificate to the US Embassy in India and have it notarized for later use when you have to prove your marital status.

Huh? Embassy Notarize a marriage certificate? Not likely, since US Notaries witness signatures and any legal marriage certificate would already be signed. We have a certified translation of our marriage certificate, a copy of which was filed with the I-130 and I-129F petitions as required. Whatever will satisfy USCIS and the Consulate that you are legally married will suffice for any other concern in the US.

While it may not be necessary (sure can't hurt), the Embassy can, will and do notarize translated marriage certificates.

"Notarize". Just what is the Notary attesting to?

They certify/attest to the validity of the signature (identity) and date of the translation.

It's really difficult to get the tone of your question from e-mail...but it appears somewhat adversarial and sarcastic per se.

Please elaborate.

I think the question is how is this signature attestation adding "value" to the document, particularly if the person whose signature is being attested to has no recognized authority.....

You might see the question as adversarial. I'm challenging you to think about what value is added by any contemplated "notarization" by a Consular official. They don't provide translation services and don't attest to the validity of a translation and they certainly cannot attest to who signed the already issued certificate.

US Consular officers can notarize documents alright but they serve the same function as a domestic Notary, in that they attest to signatures. Nobody is going to be signing a marriage certificate at a US Consulate and only a signature witnessed by a Notary in real time can be "notarized".

In China, they do use "Notarial Translation" services in that the government Notarial office provides and attests to official translation of official documents. Their function is entirely different from that of a US Notary or Consular Officer's notarial charter.

The value is that they are verifying the identity and signature of the person who signs off as the translator and by the nature of the document (wedding certificate)

they are also authenticating said document as a true document. It could also be argued that it would be expected that the Consular officer would be bi-lingual, or at least have a competency in English and the native language of the Embassy, and therefore at least make a ministerial review of the documents, therefore giving

the document at least a smidgeon more credibility than if it were notarized by the clerk at the bank. Perhaps not enough for a court of law, but enough for a government adjudicator to not send an RFE

So, you're describing a process where a translator takes the foreign marriage certificate and their translation to the US Consulate asking the Consular officer to witness their signature on the document certifying they translated the certificate?? I suppose that's possible if the translator is a US Citizen, able to avail themselves of US Citizen services inside a US Consulate. In no way does witnessing a signature attest to or add credibility to the accuracy of a translation. Consulates don't offer such translation services and would be forbidden from taking actions intended to give that impression.

Do you have any experience with actually doing this or is this just a theory you've ginned up in your own mind?

If you fully understood my first post in this thread, by saying "can, will, and do", it should be obvious that I speak from a direct experience.

So there's no reason for you to suppose...it IS possible.

I did not say that by a Consular officer notarizing a document that they are attesting to the accuracy of the translation. However, the Consular officer, without actually certifying the translation, does have an official responsibility to review the documents and to insure that they are not knowingly notarizing a fraudulent document,

or attaching the translation of a wedding certificate to a water bill (note, they do use a special device to bind the original and translation together as part of their notary process). As stated before, I would NOT expect to be able to argue that Consular notary is prima facie evidence of an accurate translation, but I do still have a very reasonable belief that an adjudicator would question a document notarized by a Consular officer, less than a couple of pieces of paper stapled together and stamped by the notary at Small Town Bank, inc.

Let's assume all that can be done. Sending a US Citizen translator into the Consulate to have their signature witnessed is an entirely different animal from the US Citizen simply taking their marriage certificate into the Consulate to have it notarized. Without somebody signing something, there's nothing to notarize. Your advice was not to have the translator's signature witnessed/notarized. The post you seconded advised a USC to take their marriage certificate to the Consulate to have it notarized.

Edited August 13, 2008 by pushbrk

[Ling Ling 22]

Do you have any experience with actually doing this or is this just a theory you've ginned up in your own mind?

Thank you for showing your true colors. In this discussion (as with most text based communication) it has been difficult to know if your intent was to be sarcastic and adversarial, but here you have clearly chosen words which a reasonable person would consider as not from an objective point of view.

I realize that you have considerable experience on this forum, and that you are respected for your knowledge. However, that does not make you always right, nor does it give you the right to not only argue experience with assumption, but it also does not give you the right to act in the manner that you do.

I believe it is equally important to act correctly as it is to be correct.

[Ling Ling 22]

Let's assume all that can be done. Sending a US Citizen translator into the Consulate to have their signature witnessed is an entirely different animal from the US Citizen simply taking their marriage certificate into the Consulate to have it notarized. Without somebody signing something, there's nothing to notarize. Your advice was not to have the translator's signature witnessed/notarized. The post you seconded advised a USC to take their marriage certificate to the Consulate to have it notarized.

Read my lips...we don't have to ASSUME it can be done. I have done it.

Second, please show me where I advised anyone NOT to have the translator's signature witnessed/notarized.

I only corrected YOUR assumption that Consular notary was not possible.

But instead of admitting that you were making a "ginned up" assumption, you chose to go down a path of debate and

now telling untruths about a course of events that is clearly documented.

You were wrong...it's going to happen every once in a while. It's not a big deal.

Please, sit back and have a slice of humble pie. If it doesn't go down smoothly, then have a nice cup of shut the frigg up.

[pushbrk 12,824]

Let's assume all that can be done. Sending a US Citizen translator into the Consulate to have their signature witnessed is an entirely different animal from the US Citizen simply taking their marriage certificate into the Consulate to have it notarized. Without somebody signing something, there's nothing to notarize. Your advice was not to have the translator's signature witnessed/notarized. The post you seconded advised a USC to take their marriage certificate to the Consulate to have it notarized.

Read my lips...we don't have to ASSUME it can be done. I have done it.

Second, please show me where I advised anyone NOT to have the translator's signature witnessed/notarized.

I only corrected YOUR assumption that Consular notary was not possible.

But instead of admitting that you were making a "ginned up" assumption, you chose to go down a path of debate and

now telling untruths about a course of events that is clearly documented.

You were wrong...it's going to happen every once in a while. It's not a big deal.

Please, sit back and have a slice of humble pie. If it doesn't go down smoothly, then have a nice cup of shut the frigg up.

Horse feathers. The advice given (not by you) was to take the marriage certificate to the Consulate and have it notarized. That won't work. What could work is to have the translator take his translation to the Consulate and have it notarized but the translator would need to be a US Citizen. Of course you didn't say "not to have the translator's signature witnessed". You said nothing at all about a translator. That's the point. The marriage certificate isn't being notarized. The translator's signature is. The original advice to take the marriage certificate to the Consulate to be notarized, won't work. They can only notarize a signature.

Further, Consulates have their own requirments for marriage certificates used to secure visas. If they will accept it, it's good enough for anything in the States.

Edited August 13, 2008 by pushbrk