I-864 particular situation

[italy to USA 0]

Hello everyone. This is really a great forum and tool for people dealing with immigration issues, so thank you.

I have more of a financial question regarding my income for the past 3 years and what I should probably put on the I-864. My wife (Italian) and I have been living together in Italy for 3 years and my income has been solely from here (a modest salary as a PhD student). Both of our salaries combined would be enough to be considered more than the 125% of the poverty line cutoff, but I will be moving to the US to begin work at University of Michigan in October and she will remain here without employment (we are expecting our first child in September ). So the point is, I DO NOT have US tax return forms for the past 3 years, but do have them from early 2006 and back. Are there other ways to provide proof of income without submitting US tax returns? Also we have a substantial amount of savings and she herself is a PhD level scientist so it should be clear that she will not be a burden to the USA.. Does anyone have any suggestions or similar experiences?

[mrsemcee 1]

Hmmm I don't know... But just wanted to wish you both luck and best wishes for your new baby and journey to the USA.

I'd be interested to hear who has been in your situationas I'm sure it will work out by using some other form of documentation to prove salary etc

[italy to USA 0]

Hey thanks alot, I think we'll need the luck

I just wanted to add something to this, since it seems to be getting more complicated by the minute.

-I did not file taxes in the US for the time that I have been in italy, including the F2555 form which states that I have income abroad. I didnt even think before to do this since I was a legal resident in Italy and paying taxes here, etc. Does that completely screw up our chances of this process going smoothly?

-Also my wife and I were only recently married, does her income before our marriage count towards our 'total income'? This would be necessary to prove that we make the minimum to get above the poverty limit.

-We are in Italy, and now I am seriously considering hiring a lawyer who is versed in this area of immigration and tax things. Would it be best to hire someone in the US and correspond electronically, or someone here?

This is just a bit disappointing and I really cannot afford to screw this up.

Any help or suggestions are super appreciated.

OSM

[Penguin_ie 5,993]

Bad news first: your current income and hers won't count, because it will stop once you go to the USA. The only income that is counted is US income, or foreign income which will continue once you are in the USA. Also just because she is a PhD doesn't mean she will be able to find a job in the US, the economy sucks right now.... However, your new income once you start work in Michigan may be enough for the I-864, depending on how much you earn. If so, just get a letter from your employer about how much you will be earning (inc any overtime, bonuses etc), and ideally a paystub or two.

Middle news: you should have filed taxes unless your PhD income was very very little. Filing taxes doesn't necessarily mean you need to pay any, but it needs to be recorded. You can back-file taxes though, so that isn't a big issue. If you made so little that it falls under the federal tax filing guidelines, you can simply write a short letter explaining this instead of including tax documents with your petition (that is what my USC husband did as he was unemployed while living with me in Ireland).

Good news: the savings will count (as will any house/ other major things you may own), even if they are in her name only. Some embassies prefer that any assets are US based, so you may want to look into opening a US bank account and transferring the savings over there. That is what we did; our DCF IR-1 was based soley on assets, which was savings transferred to a US bank account, and a US home purchased in both our names.

Will you be filing from the USA once you move back there, or will you be filing DCF (directly with the embassy) before you leave Italy? The latter option would be much quicker, and you can leave as soon as you filed the I-130 if you need to.

You probably won't need a lawyer based on what you have told us here so far; the forms are fairly straightforward, so as long as you are detail orientated and can follow directions literally, you should be able to do it yourself, with a bit of help from this site. But if you are too busy with the upcoming baby, or just feel more comfortable having a lawyer help you (and have the money... they tend to be expensive!), I'd say a US lawyer is better, that way he can help you down the road with removal of conditions for your wife once you are in the USA.

Edited July 12, 2009 by Penguin_ie

[italy to USA 0]

Hey Penguin,, first off, thank you so much for taking the time to post such a thorough explanation.

Youre right about the economy being quite bad at the moment and in fact she wont be working when she first arrives since she will be tending to the new kid

I'm pretty sure that my income (albeit not a large sum) will be enough for the minimum amount they require and I already have an official letter from the university stating that amount, etc.

About not filing.. oddly enough living in italy has just made me neglect my responsibilities back home. I didnt do it intentionally, I just didnt think I needed to, but apparently wasnt proactive enough to find out. I'll chock this up to laziness, but apparently there is a price to pay for that laziness. I have already begun filing for 2008 and will go back to and do 2007.

We are in fact applying through the US embassy here in Italy. We have just sent away the I-130 so we are really in the beginning stages of this process.

About assets, i think we have about 30k in cash in US banks and probably the same amount in euros here in italy, i feel like that should be enough to demonstrate that we will not be burdens on society for at least a little while.. at least i hope.

I think we are going to try to not panic and see if we cant go it alone without a lawyer unless things get really messy. I feel a little more in control of the situation following your post. So again, I'd like to say thanks for the help!

[Ben&Keren 0]

I believe you will need to show that you have easily liquidable assets of $18,212 (125% of poverty line for 2 people) times 3 years (instead of 5 years because you are sponsering a spouse), which equals $54,636. Otherwise you'll need a joint sponser.

Edited July 12, 2009 by Ben&Keren

[italy to USA 0]

I believe you will need to show that you have easily liquidable assets of $18,212 (125% of poverty line for 2 people) times 3 years (instead of 5 years because you are sponsering a spouse), which equals $54,636. Otherwise you'll need a joint sponser.

You think that is true? How many people have $55k around so that their wife can come home with them. I'm pretty sure that the 125% of poverty line is reflected by annual income and not savings.. I could be wrong, but.... Maybe you're talking about if we arent filing tax returns showing past income and will only show cash savings? any explanation would be nice.

[kaffy 2]

If you are using your assets to qualify they must equal at least 3 times the 125% of the poverty line limit. This is clearly explained on page 9 of the I-864 instructions http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/I-864.pdf

Past income is not considered when qualifying for the I-864, only present and continuing income is

[italy to USA 0]

If you are using your assets to qualify they must equal at least 3 times the 125% of the poverty line limit. This is clearly explained on page 9 of the I-864 instructions http://www.uscis.gov/files/form/I-864.pdf

Past income is not considered when qualifying for the I-864, only present and continuing income is

Oh OK.. why do they ask for 3 years of tax returns then? Doesnt that only represent past income? If we use assets, do you think I still have to submit 3 years of tax returns?

[kaffy 2]

I guess it's one way of showing proof that you have maintained domicile.

Even if you don't submit your past returns you will still have to provide them with an explanation as to why you havent

[Penguin_ie 5,993]

Oh OK.. why do they ask for 3 years of tax returns then? Doesnt that only represent past income? If we use assets, do you think I still have to submit 3 years of tax returns?

You have enough assets, as you said you had 30'000 savings in the USA and about the same in Italy, thus 60'000. Though, if baby is born before the interview, I believe you'll need more, as your household size will be 3, even though the baby will probably be a US citizen from birth.

They want to make sure you have files taxes I guess... Officially you only MUST submit one year, but three years are generally recommended on here as they can- and often do- ask for three years at the interview so if you don't have the proof, it'll delay things.

[Anh map 2,098]

Page 8 of the I-864 instructions (bottom of first column) speaks to the requirement for filing tax returns when living abroad.

If you end up needing to file the returns, you will have to submit the IRS transcripts for those returns as part of the I-864.

[italy to USA 0]

Page 8 of the I-864 instructions (bottom of first column) speaks to the requirement for filing tax returns when living abroad.

If you end up needing to file the returns, you will have to submit the IRS transcripts for those returns as part of the I-864.

Thanks.. I'm getting those in order to do this week. I think that between our collective savings and my income from my new job which starts Nov. 1 (38k, embarassingly) we should meet their requirements.

One thing that is weird on the I-864 are the Household size section (number 21).

In part a, it asks to enter what I entered in line 10 (# of immigrants I am sponsoring) which is 1, my wife.

Then it goes on to say enter 1 if I am married, plus the 1 is pre-entered for myself = 3. This is the household size (line h), but we are actually only 2.

Though it says specifically not to count anyone twice. How do you get around this since I would have to inevitably leave one of the spaces blank?

I think it's a bit odd.

[Anh map 2,098]

Your spouse is already included as the sponsored immigrant. It says for 21b-g : Persons NOT sponsored in this affidavit. Therefore box 21c would be left blank.

[italy to USA 0]

Your spouse is already included as the sponsored immigrant. It says for 21b-g : Persons NOT sponsored in this affidavit. Therefore box 21c would be left blank.

Thanks,.. pretty ridiculous that I missed that....woops..